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mittens
Platinum Member
United Kingdom
2109 Posts |
 Posted - 08 Apr 2009 : 10:20:25 PM
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| Gossy I bet they'll have had no end of complaints. For instance Mum's tv guide didn't have any warnings at all...how many kids who usually have to be in bed by 9 might have had their parents record it as you'd think it might just be a nature prog? Even on David Attenborough things I have to look away when it's animal killing animal but they seldom warn of that either.Yet on the news wherever humans are concerned there is ALWAYS a warning that some viewers may find scenes upsetting. I know they said at the foot of last nights but they didn't make it sound as extreme as it turned out to be.Let us know if you get a response. |
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themewoman
Silver Member
England
375 Posts |
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Kazzy
Platinum Member
England
3335 Posts |
Posted - 09 Apr 2009 : 09:36:10 AM
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In agreement with Gossy on this one.
I didnt watch the programme so cant really comment on what went on but by this thread its sounds dreadful!!!
You cant even watch a flaming cookery programme now without someone
killing something on it. Not my idea of entertainment, yes I know I have a weak stomach and I know what goes on but I DONT want to see it on my television at night.
Some people get pleasure out of watching animals being killed, not saying that people on here do but some people do. I DONT!!
I dont want to watch it, If they cant make a decent television programme today without showing animals being slaughtered then its
a bloody sad world we live in.
Janet |
     
Sunny Cheshire |
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mittens
Platinum Member
United Kingdom
2109 Posts |
Posted - 09 Apr 2009 : 09:56:23 AM
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RAFA I feel the same regarding cookery progs.My OH is a total foodie and loves watching Hugh furrywassisname's River Cottage where you can guarantee a deer will be killed.I like the fact he has shown alot of people where meat comes from and taken them through the whole process etc and made them think twice about buying supermarket cheap meats but I think we all know what happens when an animal is shot. I spoke to several friends about the program and they echoed what you said regarding a minority of people get a kick out of watching that kind of thing,although given the high volume of violent computer games and films that are sold maybe it's a bigger trend than I thought.
Themewoman,with the best will in the world kids will find a way to watch things they shouldn't;the point I was trying to make is that there might have been parents who thought it was just a program about horses and recorded it to watch another time not having looked into it's content fully. |
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gossy
Platinum Member
England
3639 Posts |
Posted - 09 Apr 2009 : 11:20:15 AM
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Themewoman,
i have every right to complain, there was no mention of killing a horse in description,so that is against the trade description act for one, for another i can have an opinion as i said i wouldnt watch a snuff movie if you know what one of them is,because i know what its content is. YES parents should have control BUT this was on before 10pm and parents wouldnt know from title or description that is was so nasty for kids, title 'Horse People with Alexandra Tolstoy' and then no description does not tell Parents let alone children that it has killing in it, The BBC have taken mine and many others i might add, complaint very seriously.
Its about time we got family values and morals back,and proper controls over tv, the world has gone mad,why would you want to watch anything being killed is beyond me!! tv which is not educational now its just plain sick.
I agree also about the cookery programmes, the F Word is also an awful programme.
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Edited by - gossy on 09 Apr 2009 11:23:03 AM |
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precious
Platinum Member
England
2253 Posts |
Posted - 09 Apr 2009 : 12:07:22 PM
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OFF BBC NEWS
Viewers complain over horse death
Alexandra Tolstoy was visibly upset by the horse's death
More than 100 viewers have complained about a graphic scene showing the killing of a horse in the BBC Two documentary Horse People.
The programme on Tuesday at 2100 BST, which was filmed in Siberia, showed a horse being choked to death before being stabbed through the heart.
A BBC spokeswoman said viewers were warned in advance that they might find some scenes "upsetting".
She said the death was included to show the life the horse herders lead.
Hoof meat
According to overnight figures, the programme attracted one million viewers at its peak, and 106 people complained.
Before the documentary started, it was introduced as the "first in a new series exploring cultures of the world centred around horses.
"Tonight's programme features a community who cares deeply for their animals, but ultimately, in scenes which some may find upsetting, kill them for food," it continued.
Presenter Alexandra Tolstoy travelled to the remote Yakutia region where the consumption of horse meat is commonplace.
We did warn viewers in advance that they may find some scenes upsetting, as Alexandra herself clearly does
BBC spokeswoman
The horse was killed because it had failed to produce a foal and was promptly skinned and had its hooves cut off as jellied hoof meat is a delicacy in the area.
As the horse was strangled and then hit over the head with an axe, Tolstoy stood nearby sobbing.
"While Alexandra was staying with the herders, they were asked to provide the meat for a horse fertility ceremony and therefore one of the horses had to be slaughtered," said the spokeswoman.
"We did warn viewers in advance that they may find some scenes upsetting, as Alexandra herself clearly does.
"As Alexandra herself says, the welfare of the animals when they are alive is of utmost importance to the men.
"Their whole lives are a constant struggle against nature and they do not have the luxury of being able to keep an animal when it is no longer useful," she added.
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Gemma Thompson
Birmingham West Midlands
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Pink Minx
Junior Member
34 Posts |
Posted - 09 Apr 2009 : 12:13:36 PM
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| I watched it up to the bit where they murdered that mare (then switched back for last 5 mins) so didnt know what they actually did to it until I read it on here! Whilst I can accept it's "their way of life" and blah blah blah, they did have a satellite dish on the side of that shack (and he was wearing a Europsport bobble hat) so they obviously can get to some sort of civilisation, so you would think they could have run to a few bullets and a gun - still not acceptable to me as a way of killing it but at least it would have been quicker. Then at the end she was complaining that the meat was tough - surprise surprise with all that adrenalin pumping round it. They should have choked on it. Otherwise an interesting and informative programme. Will make sure I'm not eating my takeaway whilst watching next time!!!!! |
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gossy
Platinum Member
England
3639 Posts |
Posted - 09 Apr 2009 : 12:21:33 PM
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| I think it shows you what a sick world we live in and if it was really 1 million viewers then i think that that is sick also, there was no warning on sky tv guide about it, nor in the tv listings so i will challenge that point thank you for bringing that to my attn, also i believe that there are a great deal more people upset by it, but either dont feel they can or dont know how to complain, typical english i think, brush it under the carpet. |
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Sadika
Platinum Member
United Kingdom
3520 Posts |
Posted - 09 Apr 2009 : 12:44:17 PM
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I wouldn't consider myself "sick" because I watched it - I am interested in horses and what happens generally in other cultures - sometimes it makes me appreciate what we have in the UK ...
I was aware of there was going to be "upsetting content" from the programme blurb - but I did not quite appreciate just how much graphically so this would be - I knew they ate horses and that therefore they must kill them but had no idea of the process.
This is a link to BBC forum where it's being discussed:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/dna/mbpointsofview/F1951566?thread=6469109
and this is the presenter's web site:
http://www.alexandratolstoy.com |
Marilyn
     
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Edited by - Sadika on 09 Apr 2009 1:06:34 PM |
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guisburnfeefee
Bronze Member
167 Posts |
Posted - 09 Apr 2009 : 1:03:40 PM
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I thought it was a very interesting programme and yes whilst the killing of the mare was very disturbing and by no means humane, the men didn't use guns at all and so my impression was that they didn't possess them. It's a completely alien way of living to ours ,and so it's difficult to say that you could ever compare their lives with ours. The environment was very harsh and yet the horses all seemed to be well cared for and loved.
I look forward to the Spanish programme - hopefully there will be some hispano arabs to drool over.  |
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gossy
Platinum Member
England
3639 Posts |
Posted - 09 Apr 2009 : 1:33:44 PM
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I to am interested in horses, i love horses and care about there welfare, i have no desire to watch one be killed.
Im affraid if its a harsh enviroment then perhaps its harsh for a reason and they should become extinct not the poor horses, After all Adam and Eve were vegetarians!!! |
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Lanabanana
Platinum Member
United Kingdom
2691 Posts |
Posted - 09 Apr 2009 : 3:26:50 PM
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Themewoman, If you came across 'Horse People' as I did you would not have realised exactly what the content of the programme would be.
My OH was flicking through the channels (as men do) and came across it just after the start, so we didn't hear the warning, nor do we get TV mags or daily papers.
I would have thought it quite possible that there would have been quite a few youngsters watching especially as we are in the middle of the Easter holidays.
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precious
Platinum Member
England
2253 Posts |
Posted - 09 Apr 2009 : 3:41:06 PM
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| Glad i didnt see any of the programme!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! |
Gemma Thompson
Birmingham West Midlands
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BabsR
Platinum Member
England
2790 Posts |
Posted - 09 Apr 2009 : 4:14:02 PM
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Have to agree with you Lindylou......have been haunted all night and day,imagining the horrific killing as described, so inhumane, poor horse!!!
Cant believe that some actually enjoyed and found it an interesting
programme to watch. There was absolutely no need to have filmed the graphic and disturbing slaughter of the terrified mare (I did not
watch the film) Apparently viewers were made aware these people eat their horses, so surely there was no need to film "the killing" except perhaps to lure viewers that may "enjoy" such a scene
Babs
www.SunrayAngloArabianStud.co.uk
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themewoman
Silver Member
England
375 Posts |
Posted - 09 Apr 2009 : 4:43:29 PM
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Lanabanana i agree with what you say about going into it half way through etc and yes it probably should've been on later.
in regards to the actual programme, they are trying to show a different way of life. To them horse is food and thats it. to us cows pigs etc, kept in tiny crates etc, everynow and again it will be brought up in the media but then go down again and how many of you can honestly say that you have not bought a egg from a chicken in battery or a pig thats been kept in the same crate for 10 months at a time. anyway i'm not preaching about that all i am trying to say is Yes it is not nice but think before we had all this modern technology, animals did used to be beaten to death. it's not a nice thing but people need to eat etc and out there in the sticks is like 100 years ago, so they had a tiny little telly with a massive satallite the way in which theny work and live is completly different.
basically you could say the same about thailand and the Child Po*n that goes on there. that isn't right at all yet children are suffering 24 hours a day in a place where they do live in the 21st century.
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CeliaS
Gold Member
Wales
646 Posts |
Posted - 09 Apr 2009 : 4:51:40 PM
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I have read everyone's comments and just for myself and my own peace of mind I have made my complaint to the BBC.
I missed the beginning of the programme so never saw any warning about the content nor did my TV guide contain any warning about upsetting scenes. |
Celia
    
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gossy
Platinum Member
England
3639 Posts |
Posted - 09 Apr 2009 : 5:43:26 PM
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Themewoman, your not getting the point, read what others have said and really think about what you are saying,
your last comment has nothing to do with this.
Im glad that there are like minded people that can see the true horror of this, and i applaud you Celia for standing up and complaining as i did.
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Edited by - gossy on 09 Apr 2009 6:42:28 PM |
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GHALEEM
Platinum Member
United Kingdom
2028 Posts |
Posted - 09 Apr 2009 : 7:30:09 PM
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I do not condone what happened to the mare and agree that there should have been stronger warnings but how many of us are honestly in a position to judge them?
What do you think those siberian people would think if they saw a television program about how we test household and beauty products on animals and the torture that is involved. If they were told that people had a choice to buy untested products but they still didnt? If they saw the horrendous waste of life and pain and suffering just to keep our faces soft and beautiful. If they saw the inside of a factory farm?
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gossy
Platinum Member
England
3639 Posts |
Posted - 09 Apr 2009 : 7:41:01 PM
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i can judge and i do, all the other things your talking about are terrible although not featured in a TV Documentary programme to glorify and make money for the BBC and the Journalist.
i dont feel that by trying to steer away from what was shown on the tv is helpful, as the more people that are aware of this, the more people can complain and actually see an end to making sick programmes.
When they have shown cannabalistic programmes on the tv which by the way i dont agree with either, they do not show how they are killed, so why should they do it for the horses,the mind boggles at the Journalist!! it does not entice me to watch but to actually to stop watching all the crap that we are paying for, Shame we dont have a modern day Mary Whitehouse. |
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Vera
Membership Moderator
United Kingdom
8652 Posts |
Posted - 09 Apr 2009 : 8:42:28 PM
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I bought a TV paper today and Tuesday's 'Horse People' programme is listed as:-
Andalucia: Alexandra travels to Jerez, where she meets a family of mounted bullfighters and undertakes a remarkable religious pilgrimage on horseback.
So expect more horse cruelty and gore. As for bullfighting - on foot and horseback is BARBARIC and IMHO a LOT WORSE than the killing of a horse for food. The horses get the most horrendous injuries yet are made to carry on 'fighting', look on YouTube its all there. As for the bulls my god what torture these magnificent beasts have to suffer in the name of entertainment.
I have never been to Spain and I never intend to go. Bullfighting is state funded and by going I would be supporting it.
What I don't know is what they do with the bulls afterwards, does anyone know? |
    
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BabsR
Platinum Member
England
2790 Posts |
Posted - 09 Apr 2009 : 9:19:21 PM
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Here Here Vera.....these sicko documentaries are purely to make money
I can only think that the Reporter herself must also be a bit "strange" to say the least, to go along and witness such stomach churning atrocities, in return for big bucks!!!
The governments of these Countries need to bring out legislation, to stop all this ghastly cruelty.....blood sports..and yes foxhunting in this Country....the list is endless, where the bloodlust of people is such that they will PAY to watch horse and bull suffer the most awful injuries, so that they can ENJOY the "bloody" sport 
I wonder how many horse lovers on A/L enjoy the bullfighting in Spain???.....can they then still say "We Love Horses"
I for one, will certainly not be watching the next or any other documentary in this sickening series
www.SunrayAngloArabianStud.co.uk |
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Edited by - BabsR on 09 Apr 2009 9:21:48 PM |
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Vera
Membership Moderator
United Kingdom
8652 Posts |
Posted - 09 Apr 2009 : 9:51:38 PM
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I'm torn. I am compelled to watch these things because then I can make true and honest statements.
I do not watch them for pleasure or entertainment, I watch for facts so I can make informed opinins. I try not to be too emotive nor be judgemental. I accept that the Siberian horse people genuinly care for their horses, in a different way to the way I care for not only my horses but all horses - all animals.
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CeliaS
Gold Member
Wales
646 Posts |
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mittens
Platinum Member
United Kingdom
2109 Posts |
Posted - 09 Apr 2009 : 11:35:24 PM
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I've just read the 5 page Points of view forum discussion on the program. Seemed to turn into an attack on the original post-maker! The majority I think,agreed that it was a horrendous death but again,the "who are we to judge" question was raised and quickly all manner of comparisons to other methods of slaugher unsued.Seemed quite a bitchy place to air your views to me! As it's clear that the program wasn't designed to provoke thoughts on animal welfare,purely a graphic insight into another culture, I see even LESS reason to have shown the killing; they could have explained verbally how it happens,or do the BBC think we too stupid to use our own imagination?
As for the Bullfighting prog next week I don't think I'll watch despite my love of Spanish horses (looking after 3 of them tomorrow).What happens to the bulls afterwards I'm unclear about but the fact they drug them and blunt the horns so they can't put up a fair fight is bad enough.As was mentioned earlier,it is government funded BUT the majority of Spaniards would happily see an end to it,it's the tourists (no doubt many from here)that go to see it and therefore it's supply and demand. |
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BabsR
Platinum Member
England
2790 Posts |
Posted - 10 Apr 2009 : 10:25:41 AM
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Apparently Vera, and I am reliably informed by a person who made a point of finding out. The bulls are dragged into a butchers shop behind the Arena, and the meat sold from there, to the general public
As I have not seen this printed in black and white, can only assume it is what happens!! I say shame on anyone who PAYS and gains pleasure from witnessing a barbaric one-sided fight, where innocent horses and bulls suffer immense cruelty, stress and a horrific death for the poor bull
Babs
www.SunrayAngloArabianStud.co.uk
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