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sam13
Junior Member
46 Posts |
 Posted - 27 Oct 2014 : 3:10:07 PM
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Hi guys, can I get your advice please? My part bred mare, is currently unregistered. We bought her from a breeder who didn't really register his horses. Whilst she is unregistered, I know her sire, but not her dam, and the stallion owner has said that she isn't his (Jeremy Kyle of the horse world). Anyways, that's not my query. The foal once born will be by a purebred stallion, and out of a part bred mare. Will this affect showing the foal as a part bred, as there is a lot af arab in there. What do judges look for with part breds? I know I am a little premature in my questions, but is like to be organised and focused
Thanks
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garnet
Platinum Member
2382 Posts |
Posted - 27 Oct 2014 : 4:08:05 PM
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| Your foal will be eligible for PBA registration if she is by a registered pure-bred Arab and will be officially 50% Arab as the dam is not registered. My Garnet was actually 62.5% Arab but as her dam wasn't registered only her sire's 50% appeared on her paperwork. Part-breds are judged as riding horses and judges will be looking for good conformation and manners - not necessarily looking very Araby as only 12.5% is required for PBA registration. Hope this helps. |
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sam13
Junior Member
46 Posts |
Posted - 27 Oct 2014 : 5:56:49 PM
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Ah, great, thank you. I called AHS today and they said it would be registered PBA, and the dam would be down as unknown, and like you, just the sire down as he is registered. How did you work out Garnets %? I didn't realise it was only 12.5% for PBA. You learn something new everyday . This will be my first foal in 10 years, and I am becoming some what neurotic! Plus I am missing riding my girly far too much!! I have told her she is only allowed 1 week maternity leave before she comes back into work!! Haha, I don't think she believed me  |
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garnet
Platinum Member
2382 Posts |
Posted - 27 Oct 2014 : 9:57:48 PM
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Garnet was by the pure-bred Ferozeshah which is the 50% and her maternal great grandmother was an unregistered pure-bred which accounts for the other 12.5% which is not recognised on her paperwork. She is the liver chestnut in my sig pics. My big PBA Vlacq Redwood Reflection, under saddle and carriage driving in my sig pics, is also 50% as he is by Vlacq Khazad (pure-bred) out of an unregistered mare Vlacq Tathar (TB x cob).
It used to be 25% Arab for PBA registration but it was reduced to 12.5% a few years ago - not a very popular move in some quarters!
Best of luck with your foaling and maternity leave - look forward to seeing pics of the baby! Who is Dad? |
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Edited by - garnet on 27 Oct 2014 10:03:30 PM |
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sam13
Junior Member
46 Posts |
Posted - 28 Oct 2014 : 06:19:53 AM
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| Chance's dam was between 2 welsh cob x Hanoverian mares, and her sire is Prince Shalamzar. She is my 3rd horse by him. Her foal is by Cwyrtai Jahaal, we used him for stud and then bought him in the summer! She's due early April. There will be photo overload! |
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garnet
Platinum Member
2382 Posts |
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sab2
Platinum Member
8467 Posts |
Posted - 29 Oct 2014 : 11:24:11 AM
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| I had a pure bred by Prince Shalamzar , good luck showing him/her , there are plenty of PBA classes and of course you can do some of the foal shows . We have shown PBA over the years , in my experience they do not like them to look too araby as Garnet says more like a riding horse/hack type. |
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heathermcbreen
Platinum Member
England
2132 Posts |
Posted - 29 Oct 2014 : 7:26:00 PM
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| Is it really right that you HAVE to plait for part bred classes..... if so I think it is ridiculous. It means I will never show my pally part bred mare... or the foal she currently expects. Mare is 31.5 % Arab with a lovely thick long white mane like an andalusian. There is no way I am ever plaiting it. Foal will be 65% Arab (Master Blaster is dad) and I will not be ever plaiting him/her either. |
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Esther
Gold Member
United Kingdom
866 Posts |
Posted - 30 Oct 2014 : 05:44:49 AM
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| I have a long-maned part bred too. I do think there is scope to widen part bred turnout criteria. It might attract more entries. They have two 'types' of turnout for coloured classes, after all.... |
paranoid horsemother
 
Photo on far right thanks to West End Photography
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sam13
Junior Member
46 Posts |
Posted - 30 Oct 2014 : 08:52:35 AM
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Ah Sab2, who was your Prince Shalamzar horse?
Thanks, but I am worried the foal is going to be a bit to araby. It's a shame I can't get Chance registered. Once she has had the foal, I am going to show jump her through the winter, and I might give working hunter a whirl the following year. I am lucky with her as she suits a short mane, and had a wonderful neck, so plaiting isn't too much of an issue. I have let it grow since she was covered and it's a big thick mess at the moment, but her forelock on the other hand is another story! She has the best forelock ever!! Ha!! Once she is back in work, she'll be pulled again. But, here's a question... If I enter the foal into a PBA class, and it's still standing with Chance, will Chance have to be plaited? She would be groomed and smart anyways, but it wouldn't be her being shown... |
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Kharidian
Platinum Member
England
4297 Posts |
Posted - 30 Oct 2014 : 09:42:24 AM
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Heathermcbreen, I think at palominos are shown unplaited in a palomino class but plaited in PBA classes.....but I might be wrong.
Caryn |
Kharidian (Prince Sadik x Khiri)........ Alkara Cassino (H Tobago x Rose Aboud)
aka "Roger".................................... aka "Chips"
     
The first image is from an original painting by Pat Shorto.
South-East Essex |
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sab2
Platinum Member
8467 Posts |
Posted - 30 Oct 2014 : 12:25:07 PM
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Sheikh Shalamzar he was born in 1996 and i bought him off Pat who bred him as a 3yr old, i kept him as an entire until we moved then he was gelded and i lent him to Kirkley collage where he had great fun with the students. I then sold him but sadly it didn,t work out so i bought him back then he went to collage again for another year then i sold him to the girl who has him now. Kirsty is doing affil DR with him and some jumping and i try to go along and support him when hes near competing and if she ever cannot keep him he will come back here to me .
Kharidian yes your right , pallies shown with full mane and tail but pba pallies shown plaited, i had to pull my pallies mane this year to show her in pbw classes , i did pull it quite long so that it would still look ok in pally classes if we do them . |
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heathermcbreen
Platinum Member
England
2132 Posts |
Posted - 30 Oct 2014 : 2:37:20 PM
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My pally is not reg as pally... only registered as PB Arab. She has a sabino white triangle of hair on her outer thigh and some black in her tail so the BPS would probably "fail" her for that anyway. Foalie could well be chestnut, or pally... I'm not bothered as chestnut and pally are equally my favourites... but if chestnut is just a part bred arab.
BUT I want to start a petition or something.... it is illogical to insist part breds are plaited and this needs to change, as Ester said it would definitely increase show entries. Lots of part breds have magnificent manes and in my view it is unacceptable to have to pull to plait them. I feel like making an issue of it by entering classes and bringing in my horse unplaited as a protest !! I know I will be eliminated.... but so what... I like being a rebel. Does anyone know of any high(ish) up person I could write too to voice my feelings on this issue to..... or do you all think I'm out of order and should plait because thats the way it is. .... or are there any more Esters who think there should be some relaxation of this rule. A judge should be able to see if a horse has a good neck by looking at the non mane side. There is no real reason/purpose for this ruling that I can see. |
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sab2
Platinum Member
8467 Posts |
Posted - 30 Oct 2014 : 5:54:49 PM
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This is my pbw pally, the plaits don,t look too bulky and the mane is still very long so she will still not look too bad in pally classes if i do some next year.
Heathermcbreen i don,t suppose you will be eliminated for showing with long mane and tail but maybe be down the line up perhaps, of course it will depend on what level you are showing at. I think they look really smart plaited so don,t mind |
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debs
Platinum Member
United Kingdom
3218 Posts |
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Ziadomira
Platinum Member
England
1635 Posts |
Posted - 30 Oct 2014 : 7:35:33 PM
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Some high percentage coloureds and palominos are shown with a long plait. This can look quite good and can be undone for the other classes.
Might be difficult to get the general idea of plaiting PBAs and AAs changed it would be like starting to plait Pure Breds. if you really don't want to touch the mane the long plait is the best thing if your don't want tennis balls on your horses neck. Must say I like the plaiting shown on the Pally shown. |
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Ari
Platinum Member
1657 Posts |
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heathermcbreen
Platinum Member
England
2132 Posts |
Posted - 30 Oct 2014 : 8:08:09 PM
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| Sallys pally does look really lovely.... BUT it should be a matter of choice. Plaits have a practical point if you are riding as they stop the mane from getting in the way... but in a in-hand class it should not matter. If its about looking at necks then why wouldn't pure Arabs have to be plaited... and if a judge places a horse on the quality of the plaiting !! well I wouldnt stand a chance anyway. Mine look like something you would scrub pots with in the sink. The running plait is easier and copes with unpulled manes but does not look as nice as standard plaits... in my opinion that is of course. |
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Vik1
Platinum Member
1711 Posts |
Posted - 30 Oct 2014 : 10:51:42 PM
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My understanding of showing part breds is they should resemble a 'type' eg riding pony, riding horse, srt, hack, hunter etc....all those types are shown plaited and so that is why part breds are shown plaited.
What I think would be interesting is say you had a pba that was like a coloured native for example. A pony with 12.5% arab, rest of it welsh/gypsy cob could easily be a native type and therefore be shown trimmed (to a point) but natural. Your very unlikely to ever seen one like that in a pba class though. I can just imagine it would be talk of the steamy...coloured, chunky and unplaited. It would stick out in a pba class like a sore thumb, lol. Would be interesting to see how a judge would take to it. |
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Esther
Gold Member
United Kingdom
866 Posts |
Posted - 31 Oct 2014 : 05:09:35 AM
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Wolf is Welsh d x NSH, and coloured at that. He did stick out like a sore thumb in the PBA classes - a line of bay riding horse/hack types and then him. I got talking to a lady at another show with a coloured Welsh type and she said it depended on the judge - she found hers would either win or come last.
The 50% part bred (Welsh D x Arab) I used to ride did county showing alongside endurance. He did really well in hunter/working hunter classes but didn't stand a hope in pba classes - he was a very similar build to Wolf, chunky but not heavy.
We're missing out on all the wonderful variety there is in our PBAs. They do come in so many different models other than 'bay hack'  |
paranoid horsemother
Photo on far right thanks to West End Photography
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debs
Platinum Member
United Kingdom
3218 Posts |
Posted - 31 Oct 2014 : 07:28:49 AM
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Just like us Esther when we take Mika showing he is coloured 69% arab. He stands out like a multi coloured sore thumb! He won so much at the nationals this year, his first year out but last at nearly every other, non arab show!!! Stood out even at the cherif, didn't do great there either
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heathermcbreen
Platinum Member
England
2132 Posts |
Posted - 31 Oct 2014 : 6:02:51 PM
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| Sticking out like a sore thumb sounds good to me !! at least it is not boring !!! |
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Vik1
Platinum Member
1711 Posts |
Posted - 01 Nov 2014 : 11:01:11 AM
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| Im planning to give some part bred classes a bash next year. Although there arent many in scotland any more. The shows that have pba classes are at least a 2-3 hour drive (Im too lazy for that, lol) I have to admit, it is quite off putting being an adult taking a hunter type into a class full of riding ponies and children but if the classes arent supported we will lose them altogether. Plus if more do it then maybe more of my boys type will be encouraged to enter. |
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Showing part breds
