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Gerri
Platinum Member
 England
4211 Posts |
 Posted - 14 Nov 2011 : 12:51:24 PM
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Can someone please advise me on Navicular? we have been out and about looking at horses as my husband now feels he is ready to love another horse after losing his horse years ago on the operating table and thought he would never again feel able to love another horse the way he did Ben anyway, we do not have lots of money, but felt that we could afford to get him a happy hack so that he could ride out with me, but he needs a big horse to take up his leg as he is 6ft 4" tall but only weighs 12 stone max anyway he went to try a horse yesterday who he fell in love with and That we can afford to buy, but he has just been diagnosed with Naviclar, so he will need egg bar shoes and supplements etc, which is fair enough, but apart from knowing what navicular is vaguely I have never have a horse with Navicular so don't really know the implications and I worry about my husband as I know he will be totally emotionally attached to his new horse, so whilst I am over the moon that he has found a horse, I am worried that no matter what treatment the horse will need that he might end up getting nothing back from this horse in as far as not being able to ride him? can you give me your thoughts please? am I over reacting? I know its a progressive thing so will never improve, but how qickly will it progress? the horse was competed at top level for a while and was diagnosed 6 months ago.
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Edited by - Gerri on 22 Nov 2011 12:24:10 PM
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sasha
Gold Member
United Kingdom
518 Posts |
Posted - 14 Nov 2011 : 1:51:52 PM
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Having brought a navicular diagnosed horse back to sound by taking the shoes off and gently working him barefoot and allowing the heels to go back to the correct place and the toes much shorter.. he is still sound 2 years later.I will find some info on the web for you to read.Then you can make your own judgement. |
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kimzi
Gold Member
865 Posts |
Posted - 14 Nov 2011 : 2:00:24 PM
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| Naviular is erosion of the navicular bone, it can't grow back, the condition causes intermittent lameness in the early stages. I'm sure gerri will make the right decision for her.xxx |
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Quarabian
Platinum Member
Wales
4340 Posts |
Posted - 14 Nov 2011 : 2:19:15 PM
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My old boy has navicular. I stopped riding him 2 years after being diagnosed. He has been retired for 7 years now and has a reasonable quality of life, but I am preparing myself for the decision to pts perhaps this winter. It is heart breaking because it is a progressive illness. Any damage done cannot be repaired and it will only get worse. Some horses do repond to treatment and can be ridden, but for me my old boy could not stride out as he used to do and he can't cope with the hills in Wales. If you are in a flat area with grass verges to ride on then maybe consider a permanent loan, but I would not part with any money because you will need that for the vet's bills. The owner should realise that you would be doing them a favour by taking the responsibility for this horses welfare.
Sorry if this sounds negative Gerri, this is only coming from my experience and others will have a different view. |
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shah
Gold Member
England
1356 Posts |
Posted - 14 Nov 2011 : 2:28:22 PM
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Depends on whether there are bone changes involved or not. If there are no bone changes they can be brought back to work successfully but if it's more serious the prognosis is worse. I would ask lots of questions about how the horse was diagnosed, have they had xrays, MRI scans, and would they show these to you? What has been done to treat it so far? If it was early stages and they have done a lot of treatment then they should be far ahead in the recovery phase in 6 months time, but if they've done nothing you may be facing expensive treatments.
In any case the journey will be expensive, time consuming and an emotional rollercoaster. I had to make a similar decision this year and looked into it in detail. You may want to speak to some of the barefoot trimmers who can advise you on long term prognosis, or places like Rockley, who have a lot of experience. Might also be worth getting the advise of a friendly and knowledgeable vet.
Good luck! I'm sure you'll make the right decision for you and your hubby |
West Sussex |
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Gerri
Platinum Member
England
4211 Posts |
Posted - 14 Nov 2011 : 2:38:15 PM
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Thank you soo much for your replies, the lady has maxed out her insurance on him, she was honest although she said the vet said he would probably be fine to be a happy hacker so we would not be able to insure him for anything to do with his feet it would be down to us, to be honest she only asked £600 for him. My husband is soo excited about having his own horse again I tried to explain about my fears but he seemed to ignore it, I have said I will get back to her when we have had a think, but he is asking me when we should get him and has arranged a stable all ready for him and wants me to get onto the farrier about the special shoes and given me a list of supplements for him, he rode him and came back with a huge smile on his face, I don't think she will loan him as she was selling him as a light hack/companion |
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Kharidian
Platinum Member
England
4297 Posts |
Posted - 14 Nov 2011 : 2:51:34 PM
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Speaking with my head not my heart I'd say leave well alone - you're just looking to long term heartache. There
ust be plenty of other happy hacks around - especially if this is the first your hubby has seen.
Just my opinion.
Caryn |
Kharidian (Prince Sadik x Khiri)........ Alkara Cassino (H Tobago x Rose Aboud)
aka "Roger".................................... aka "Chips"
     
The first image is from an original painting by Pat Shorto.
South-East Essex |
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clio
Gold Member
Wales
614 Posts |
Posted - 14 Nov 2011 : 3:02:20 PM
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Oh Gerri please get him vetted and ask to speak to there vet about him with your husband before you make any plans.
We have a mare (who is out on loan .. i felt i couldnt sell her knowing she had Navicular) who was my daughters BSJA mare when she came down with it 9 years ago, but because my daughter felt she was not working properly (she couldnt explain it at the time but knew the horse was not right) we caught it early and with shoes and a great vet she came sound.
Guinness is only a plod now but does do the odd small jumping round and is as sound as any other horse tho arthretic now but she is getting on abit.
But a couple of years ago a friend asked me the same question regarding navicular and took on what turned out to be a huge vets bill and had to have the poor horse PTS 18 months after purchasing him so please beware, i would echo Quarabian's advice :( |
   
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sasha
Gold Member
United Kingdom
518 Posts |
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Misshana
Silver Member
England
449 Posts |
Posted - 14 Nov 2011 : 3:08:49 PM
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Gerri I have recently had the same experience. I found the absolutely perfect horse for me but he turned out to have been diagnosed with navicular. I already have my old boy who is not totally sound and wanted something to carry on riding so with an extremely heavy heart, I returned him. I would have kept him on loan but his owner wanted him sold. I know it is possible sometimes to have a good few years but to be honest we have to do roadwork, so barefoot is not really an option and the possibility of vet bills in the future made the decision for me. Navicular can apparently be very intermittent so not the easiest thing to deal with. I cried buckets when he went home but I had to be practical.
Might be cheap to buy but could be very costly in the long term especially without insurance cover.
I advertised in the local tack shops for a happy hacker and got offered several on loan so that might be a better option for you.
Unfortunately I really wanted an Arab!!!! Most of those I was offered were TB or hunter types. Not my cup of tea but maybe would suit your OH |
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Callisto
Platinum Member
6905 Posts |
Posted - 14 Nov 2011 : 3:19:15 PM
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| I would also advise extreme caution, I think it is very important that you speak to the vet that has treated him, or if that is not possible then at least speak to your own vet for advice. There are success stories, but there are also the other sadder experiences, and I don't think you two need that after all you have been through. There are many horses out there looking for a home, it is so hard when you have set your heart on one, only to find there are problems, it happened to me twice when I was looking, but it worked out well because I now have Lily who I love very much. I think looking for a horse on loan is a very good suggestion. |
  Zahkira (GR Amaretto x Taffetta)
Linda
East Sussex |
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shah
Gold Member
England
1356 Posts |
Posted - 14 Nov 2011 : 5:17:24 PM
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Linda, only twice  I've been through it five times now, and still have no horse to show for it 
Gerri, I agree with the others. Think very carefully before making a decision. You don't need more heartache. |
West Sussex |
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Suelin
Platinum Member
England
2514 Posts |
Posted - 14 Nov 2011 : 5:37:16 PM
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| I would say leave it. There are many other sound horses out there, you just need to look. |
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sab2
Platinum Member
8467 Posts |
Posted - 14 Nov 2011 : 5:43:48 PM
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| I agree with the above please think very carefully, a friend of ours took one on with navicular and 6months later after amassing a huge vets bill the horse was sadly pts, good luck whatever you decide. |
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Gerri
Platinum Member
England
4211 Posts |
Posted - 14 Nov 2011 : 5:51:23 PM
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Thank you soooo much for your LOVELY and HEARTFELT replies, I cannot begin to thank you for obviously caring about us, it has quite upset me to think that you have never ever met me but your replies have shown me you are safegaurding me from more heartache and it really means the whole world to me that you care......sorry I know I must sound really soft but it is truly how I feel I am going to talk to the lady and see what she says, I will ask if I can speak to the vet and also if we could have him on loan, she can come to see where we are and speak to the yard owner and the previous yard owner and the vets who we dealt with for many years when in the UK before moving to France as they can tell her how we are with our horses, I sooo don't want my husband to be saddened by anything, he is such a good man and so loving with all my animals and just want him to have a little of the happiness that I have he always does Milly for me when I am at work and spends time grooming her and spoiling her without any of the riding and I feel mean it was okay while I knew he did not want another horse after his Ben, he adored that horse even more than me and it destroyed him when he died, he told the vets to do what ever they could to save him and it took us 2 years to pay off the huge bill left when he died, but he never complained just talked about the times they shared and how much he loved him and he always said he thought he would never ever get another horse as there would never be another Ben even our vet asked him to take on a horse that was being put down as the owner loved it soo much she could not bear her to go to anyone else and was a dressage horse but the women who was elderly had a fall and could not continue riding and my vet thought that she would be perfect for my husband and had talked the woman into just giving it a try as he could recommend the home....Sadly my Hubby would not take the horse, he was still sooo raw from losing Ben and could not even look at another horse, I pleaded for the horses sake more than anything but he would not budge, so all these years later he says he is ready, I have to say I am thrilled for selfish reasons......I miss riding out with him for sooo long and have not ridden myself for years I have taken on board everything you have said and I will ask to speak to the vet that treated this horse and ask if she will loan him and if it does not work out if she will take him back (that will be the hardest thing as my hubby will be attached) no we have looked at a few, some not the size advertised and some with real temperament problems its the size thats the problem if he could ride a 16hh TB it would be perfect but he has such long legs and says he seems to knock their elbows when riding them and he likes a chunky horse as feels safer |
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Judith S
Platinum Member
Wales
15686 Posts |
Posted - 14 Nov 2011 : 6:03:57 PM
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You can manage navicular but not cure it, good barefoot can be better than shoeing. Having one with navicular we are now just waiting until life becomes too hard for him and then he will be pts.
Why set yourselves up for inevitable heartache when there are so may sound horses looking for homes? |
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Pasch
Platinum Member
2277 Posts |
Posted - 14 Nov 2011 : 7:59:51 PM
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Agree with all the others,especially being your husband such a gentle man and already so heartbroken from the loss of his first horse,why take another horse that could so easily have to be pts after a short time?That would be such an unnecessary blow and put him off horses for good.For the same reason I wouldn't consider the loan,as you would be faced with giving the horse back once lame to be pts by the owner.
Your husband has waited so long to be ready for another horse,it is better not to hurry now and take all the time needed to find a healthy horse he likes.Let us know what decision you will take. |
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Gerri
Platinum Member
England
4211 Posts |
Posted - 14 Nov 2011 : 10:00:54 PM
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Yes you are right, and I have said this to him, he is now thinking about this situation really seriously, this is exactly what I am afraid of the last thing I want is him to be so upset again that he cannot face going through it all again. I rang the lady this evening and she said she will come anyway tomorrow and talk it over with me??? I explained all my fears to her and told her that even though he is sooo little money, its the heartache that I cannot face and am soo afraid for my husband, I will let you know what happens I hope and pray that she is not too angry and feels we have wasted her time but with all that I have read and all that you have all said its just not worth it, I hate feeling like this though and seeing Syes face he knows what I am saying and he has read your posts too and very reluctantly agreeing, this is when I wish I had a majic wand |
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Quarabian
Platinum Member
Wales
4340 Posts |
Posted - 14 Nov 2011 : 11:26:15 PM
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I remember that he found a horse to ride just before you had to leave your last home. Surely fate will play a part here. There must be someone local who has the right horse and needs a rider. or put an ad in your local tack shop for a loan. Wish you luck. |
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Libby Frost
Platinum Member
United Kingdom
4711 Posts |
Posted - 14 Nov 2011 : 11:30:12 PM
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| Avoid it m8, got to be sounder horses nearby for sale, this horse will probably be lame more often than hes not :( . |
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Gerri
Platinum Member
England
4211 Posts |
Posted - 15 Nov 2011 : 1:00:03 PM
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| Just got home from work Imentioned "barefoot" to the owner and she nearly had a fit saying there was no way he could go barefoot as he found it sooo painful, I am meeting her today to talk everything through and then if there is no way back then I will walk away, I would hate having to have something PTS and maybe she is selling him so she does not have to do the dreaded deed, never thought about that side of it at all. The horse he rode at my last yard was lovely, a 16hh+ TB but Sy said he was like sitting on a peg!!!! he liked him very much as a horse and personality wise but he did not want to loan as would get too emotionally attached, could not face having to give him back at a later date, sadly we cannot afford to buy something that would be perfect before xmas as have just caught up with things financially and now have xmas and the whole family coming and I want to spoil the Grandchildren as not had a xmas with the family in years and to be honest I always like a bit stashed for a rainy day for Milly and the dogs and now the cats as one never knows when something untoward may happen, the horses got sick when we first arrived back to the UK and it was a nightmare so don't want to be in a position like that again, so maybe we will just have to save a bit more to get the right horse, I will see what she says today, but I think you are all right in what you say. I will pay her petrol for today so that she feels she has not had a wasted jpurney , she would not really talk about it on the phone she said she will come over and chat to me then and if I really don't want to buy him then maybe we could sort something else out???? so will see what she says |
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Callisto
Platinum Member
6905 Posts |
Posted - 15 Nov 2011 : 1:31:45 PM
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| If this doesn't work out, what about contacting World Horse Welfare or the Blue Cross or other horse rehoming charities? I understand they are overflowing at the moment - and they are not all rescues, many are there because their owners just couldn't cope any more - you could well find exactly what your husband is looking for and be able to offer a permanant loving home to a deserving horse. |
Zahkira (GR Amaretto x Taffetta)
Linda
East Sussex |
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Pasch
Platinum Member
2277 Posts |
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Offira
Platinum Member
England
1583 Posts |
Posted - 16 Nov 2011 : 12:49:04 PM
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In your shoes I would avoid navicular (sadly) as you are buying trouble and heartache. I knew a fabulous horse who was put down with navicular and it still upsets me 30 years later that his life was cut short.
There are so many horses that people are just having to get rid of at the moment that I am sure you could have your pick. There are a lot of TBs on the market, could you contact your local trainer to see if any are available, they are usually free to good home or nominal amounts. At a recent sale ex-racers were going for £300 straight to the meatman  lovely young sound horses. My OH is 6ft 4ins and rode a 16.3 TB the other day, he looked OK (his own horse is a Shire x).
If you absolutely have to have the navicular horse, then shoes off is much the best way.
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Hollyhill
Gold Member
589 Posts |
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Gerri
Platinum Member
England
4211 Posts |
Posted - 16 Nov 2011 : 5:25:26 PM
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Have replied Hollyhillx Well the lady fell in love with the yard and agreed to loaning so that if the inevitable happens he would go back to her.....but I said that I wanted to speak to the vet first before making any firm decision, and also I have seen something else that maybe exactly what we are looking for Thank you everyone for your kind replies to this post I really appreciate your thoughts and comments |
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Navicular???? UPDATED
