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ella
Gold Member
 United Kingdom
786 Posts |
 Posted - 04 Jun 2009 : 6:04:53 PM
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:-( :-( :-(
My poor gelding who has been very lame on alternate/both hind limbs
for the past 3 weeks has been shown to have desmitis of the distal
suspensary apparatus.
He has rear pastern swelling, windgalls & constantly rests a hindleg,
switching every 1-3days.
Has anyone seen/treated/managed this & had a return to ridden soundness?
Because we can’t see any lesions in the more proximal suspensory
branches I have my hopes pinned on this NOT being the genetic DSLD,
but a result of injury coupled with longish pasterns.
Gee, I hope there’s one of you who’s had a successful outcome
treating this :-(
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"If an 'alternative treatment' has reliable effect it becomes classified simply as MEDICINE" D.B. |
Edited by - ella on 30 Oct 2009 6:33:04 PM
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Kelly
Platinum Member
England
1571 Posts |
Posted - 07 Jun 2009 : 8:41:06 PM
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I don't understand half the words in your post Alison, but I've still got everything crossed for you and Dior.
Keep me posted.
Hugs to you both (go on then, one for Arro too). x |
Kelly
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Theo
Silver Member
England
368 Posts |
Posted - 07 Jun 2009 : 10:33:19 PM
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Hi Ella,
Have you diagnosed this problem thru direct ultrasound scans? What's your current prescribed tx and not working I presumne?
T x
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ella
Gold Member
United Kingdom
786 Posts |
Posted - 09 Jun 2009 : 5:44:14 PM
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Thanks Kelly :-),
Hi Theo, I have viewed the ultrasound images & radiographs of my gelding¡¦s fetlocks/pasterns. He has roughened areas around the sesamoids & 'holes' in the sesamoidean ligaments of both hind legs.
He¡¦s currently having 2x bute daily, a topical steroid + DMSO ointment & electric pen or box rest. The bute reduces the lameness, but he's still pretty uncomfortable. It's very hard to assess the degree of lameness when lame on 2 limbs.
Is this a condition that few have seen? Or do owners mistake 'dropping fetlocks' in older horses as a normal ageing process?
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"If an 'alternative treatment' has reliable effect it becomes classified simply as MEDICINE" D.B. |
Edited by - ella on 09 Jun 2009 5:45:44 PM |
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LIV
Gold Member
England
705 Posts |
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Theo
Silver Member
England
368 Posts |
Posted - 09 Jun 2009 : 11:35:01 PM
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Hi Ella,
Have seen this sort of injury in racehorses, and unfortunately the prognosis does not sound great, it's often a matter of damage limitation. The damage to the sesamoids can only be limited by a series of 'hirulon' injections which costs a fortune! And never guaranteed to work. My major concern would be the 'holes' in the ligaments, which under current 'veterinary guidelines' cannot be treated with any more agressive methods other that NSAID's and steroids. DMSO topically is great. I have seen more aggressive forms of treatment abroad which I shall PM you about.
Best regards,
Theo |
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debs
Platinum Member
United Kingdom
3218 Posts |
Posted - 18 Jun 2009 : 5:55:35 PM
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Hi, I lost my horse of a lifetime at the beginning of the year to ESPA, of which DSLD was a symptom. The vets had no idea what it was to start with as Giz was just stood with his back hunched up... after 3 daily visits the only noticeable change was that his fetlocks suddenly dropped right down, they sent him off to RVC at South Mimms and an Israeli vet saw him off the lorry and knew what it was immediately.The scans showed that there really was no hope, they said his legs could rupture at any time... He did also say that this was only the second case he had seen in 15 years, but thought that the dropped fetlocks in older horses was maybe just thought of as old age/wear and tear.Other symptoms of ESPA, ie blindness, he thought would also be put to old age.
My boy had never had a day's lameness in his 17 years.
Looking on various websites there seems to be some positive recoveries.
If they are treating yours there looks like there could be hope... so stay positive. Good luck.Will be thinking of you, hope all ends well, Debs Originally posted by ella
Thanks Kelly :-),
Hi Theo, I have viewed the ultrasound images & radiographs of my gelding¡¦s fetlocks/pasterns. He has roughened areas around the sesamoids & 'holes' in the sesamoidean ligaments of both hind legs.
He¡¦s currently having 2x bute daily, a topical steroid + DMSO ointment & electric pen or box rest. The bute reduces the lameness, but he's still pretty uncomfortable. It's very hard to assess the degree of lameness when lame on 2 limbs.
Is this a condition that few have seen? Or do owners mistake 'dropping fetlocks' in older horses as a normal ageing process?
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ella
Gold Member
United Kingdom
786 Posts |
Posted - 19 Jun 2009 : 5:19:16 PM
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Hi Debs, thank you for sharing your boy's story.
I'm still hoping that ESPA is not the cause of my gelding's problems, though it is certainly high on the list of possibilities & like your's he hasn't ever had lameness other than this bilateral problem.
Was ESPA confirmed by pathology on your horse?
He doesn't have dropped fetlocks (yet), I hope it doesn't come to that.  |
"If an 'alternative treatment' has reliable effect it becomes classified simply as MEDICINE" D.B. |
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debs
Platinum Member
United Kingdom
3218 Posts |
Posted - 19 Jun 2009 : 10:51:47 PM
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Hi Ella,
No wasn't confirmed.
Keep us posted...stay positive.
Debs |
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debs
Platinum Member
United Kingdom
3218 Posts |
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ella
Gold Member
United Kingdom
786 Posts |
Posted - 06 Jul 2009 : 6:52:11 PM
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Hi, thanks for asking.
My Desert Donkey has improved considerably with 5 weeks of pen rest & bute, though he still looks a bit sore some days:
I’m to stop the bute this week so I expect to see the real results of the confinement in a few days – watch this space! Hopefully he’ll progress to playing with his friends in another few weeks.
There’s no sign of worsening pastern angles yet thankfully.
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"If an 'alternative treatment' has reliable effect it becomes classified simply as MEDICINE" D.B. |
Edited by - ella on 06 Jul 2009 6:56:15 PM |
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Theo
Silver Member
England
368 Posts |
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debs
Platinum Member
United Kingdom
3218 Posts |
Posted - 06 Jul 2009 : 11:04:27 PM
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| Bless him.... good luck! Keeping fingers crossed....x |
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ella
Gold Member
United Kingdom
786 Posts |
Posted - 10 Jul 2009 : 5:37:59 PM
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Poor Dior is back standing on 3 legs this morning, 2 days after withdrawing the bute  . It really doesn't seem as though the resting has helped at all 
This is such a disaster. I really had thought he looked better the last couple of weeks.
Dunno what we're going to do now, should probably set an initial time limit on how long it's fair to live on drugs in a very small space?
This is so hard to think about, I had to leave work to cry for 1/2hr earlier 
There just doesn't seem to be anything else to help him. |
"If an 'alternative treatment' has reliable effect it becomes classified simply as MEDICINE" D.B. |
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debs
Platinum Member
United Kingdom
3218 Posts |
Posted - 12 Jul 2009 : 6:58:05 PM
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Oh poor you and poor Dior. I know what you are going through. If that is the only option you just have to do the right thing for him, no matter how hard it seems. Will obviously take time for you to adjust, was the worst decision I had to make in my life, but I know it was the right one. He knows how much you love him and you will have so many happy memories of your time together.
Thinking of you both at this awful time, take care Debs x
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Zan
Platinum Member
Scotland
3213 Posts |
Posted - 12 Jul 2009 : 7:44:08 PM
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| So sorry to read this. Does it have to be a very small space and drugs, or could he be field sound on drugs? |
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Eeyore
Gold Member
1181 Posts |
Posted - 16 Jul 2009 : 09:28:45 AM
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| So sory to hear about your Dior. I have pm'd you my experience of suspensory ligament desmitis but I don't know if it will be much help. |
Heléna
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debs
Platinum Member
United Kingdom
3218 Posts |
Posted - 18 Jul 2009 : 11:35:31 PM
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| Ella, how's your boy? Hope you are ok too. |
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ella
Gold Member
United Kingdom
786 Posts |
Posted - 21 Jul 2009 : 2:02:30 PM
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Hi, a Desert Donkey update:
When horse vet saw Dior last week he was pretty horrified at the degree of lameness despite rest etc., so we’ve pretty much given up on healing & gone down the route of “everything deserves to try steroids before it dies”.
So on Thursday he had long-acting steroids injected into the rear of his pasterns & into the DDFT sheaths.
He thinks he is fixed! Makes me realise just how long it is since I last saw him moving properly L.
Unfortunately, after only 2 days he was dragging his toes & shifting weight again, though he looks good today.
Such a rollercoaster. Back to waiting with fingers crossed again.
Thanks for all the texts & pm’s.
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debs
Platinum Member
United Kingdom
3218 Posts |
Posted - 21 Jul 2009 : 10:26:53 PM
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| Keeping fingers crossed for you both. Keep your chin up! Spoil him rotten, hope someones spoiling you too x |
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ella
Gold Member
United Kingdom
786 Posts |
Posted - 23 Oct 2009 : 2:15:13 PM
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Hi, well I guess it's time for an update.
Dior became very lame again 4weeks to the day after injecting the steroids. We had hoped a prolonged period of good anti-inflamatory effect would help things to settle, but he was no better at all :-(
I asked vet to gather opinions on desmoplasty/fasciotomy for him & was put in contact with Prof Peter Clegg at Leahurst.
He has viewed all the images & I have been persuaded to travel Dior to Leahurst for further workup.
In short, we are still unlikely to be able to help him, but the current diagnosis (bilateral oblique sesamoidean desmitis) so rarely causes this degeree of lameness that he feels it is worth checking there is nothing else going on that may affect prognosis.
We’re going on Monday, cross fingers please.
Initially I was reluctant to tow him “on 3 legs” (he needs to be off meds for the assessment) so my boss has v kindly taken the day off to transport us in his brand new wagon. Couldn’t really refuse that!
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"If an 'alternative treatment' has reliable effect it becomes classified simply as MEDICINE" D.B. |
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debs
Platinum Member
United Kingdom
3218 Posts |
Posted - 23 Oct 2009 : 7:36:21 PM
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Hi Ella,
I have often thought of you both, good luck and keep us posted please.
Fingers crossed. Debs |
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Red Rum
Gold Member
England
508 Posts |
Posted - 23 Oct 2009 : 10:04:57 PM
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Ella good luck hope all goes ok. My boy has mild suspensory desmitus but keeping him in light work has helped.
He went to Liphook and my vet was against an operation which would have cost over £5,000. But he was never that lame only found out what was wrong as when we lunged him he lifted one back leg higher than the other and hated walking down steep hills. Mandy |
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geegee
Platinum Member
England
3682 Posts |
Posted - 25 Oct 2009 : 08:36:13 AM
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| My thoughts will be with you tomorrow....Hope things look brighter for you and your boy. |
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Nut
Platinum Member
United Kingdom
2838 Posts |
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ella
Gold Member
United Kingdom
786 Posts |
Posted - 28 Oct 2009 : 6:24:09 PM
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Well not good news I’m afraid .
Prof Clegg was unable to find any disease other than the v slight arthritic changes + desmitis of his oblique seamoidean ligaments that my 1st opinion vet already diagnosed.
He says he has never seen a bilateral case before, & never a horse with this presentation & degree of lameness. “Unique” was his choice of term.
It is probable that this is some kind of genetic connective tissue disorder & that it is degenerative & will progress over time.
There’s no disease in his more proximal suspensory ligament/branches so this is different to the DSLD that affects Paso horses.
Great. Yet again I have a horse with a very “rare & interesting” disease.
My day started badly when my chauffeur’s flight back from Malaga was delayed, meaning he didn’t get a lot of sleep. Then the new wagon wouldn’t start – flat battery, which wouldn’t jump-start. Still, he still has the “old” wagon so we went in that.
The motorway junction has changed so I missed the exit, expecting a roundabout to find it has been removed. Aaargh!
Dior stood like a rock at all the important points for his scans & radiographs, though he added plenty of Arab sound effects. As the disappointing findings continued to stack up though, I was close to snapping at the next person who commented on “how good he is FOR AN ARAB”!!!
He is not “good for an Arab”, he is not “laid back” he is just blurdy well trained, like all horses should be!
There was a Highland mare also having limb scans which had needed sedation. I didn’t hear anyone comment she was “bad for a Highland”!!!
Sorry, I digress. Think I’m pretty grumpy about the whole frustrating situation.
Prof Clegg would very much like to see Dior again when he’s really lame.
He’d also love to have MRI images because the pathology is so interesting.
Desert Donkey & I are not keen for either at present. It’s not going to help him.
There are no treatments which will help. I could have fetlock arthrodesis when his ligaments fail completely, but having seen the pain dogs often suffer after this procedure I don’t believe it’s ethical in 2 limbs of a horse.
So there we are. Officially wrecked. The good news is Dior can now live a more normal life for a while & escape his prison cell to graze with his friends.
He looks pretty comfortable & has lost none of his athletic ability, pinging straight over the electric tape of his recovery pen into the wider field! Hope he’s not hopping tonight….
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Sesamoidean ligament desmitis - bad news :-(
x
