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ACGODFREY
Silver Member
United Kingdom
440 Posts |
 Posted - 01 Feb 2009 : 8:47:26 PM
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Any innovative ideas how to teach this to a more sensitive soul? My boy does this well in hand for a couple of steps, although struggles to go straight. When under saddle with a person on the ground asking him, as if inhand, he gets most upset, hollows and shakes his head, moving sideways. As his rider, I move my lower leg marginally behind the girth, 'lift' my weight off my seat bones (again, very slightly) and have tiny bit of contact on the rein (as he doesn't like contact generally). It usually works for other horses. He is slightly arthritic in his near hind and is quite weak behind so I am wondering if I shouldn't bother doing rein back with him. He is one of those horses that gets most upset if he's not sure of something, but once reassured and he gets it, he's very good.
It's not for dressage, but for Trec, where you have to do rein back through a corridor of poles about 2 foot apart, so there is guidance for the straight line.
Any ideas appreciated.
Thanks
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Mrs Vlacq
Platinum Member
Wales
3776 Posts |
Posted - 01 Feb 2009 : 9:40:03 PM
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Book a lesson with a Western trainer and ask to learn it their way - on the ground, then on board.....
I did and will never teach it any other way now. No contact, all weight and voice... was backing through S bends in 1 session on a stressy horse - amazing!!
For now - work on your turn on forehand and haunches with the emphasis on weight aids. Do exercises at walls/hedges - progress to side-pass by pivoting: 1 step turn on fore, 1 step turn on haunch. Then to true sidepass with legs crossing. Soon find backwards very easy!! |
    
- V Khazad - V Calacirya & V Sulime - Quarida(L) - V Boogie Knights - V Hamra Tofiq |
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Theo
Silver Member
England
368 Posts |
Posted - 01 Feb 2009 : 10:09:48 PM
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Our reinbacks start from double line long reining, at the end of a session we ask the horse to rein back a few steps before halting and relaxing to unclip... Geebs seems to be able to reinback better that going forwards! 
In classical 'English' riding, emphasis seems to be put on forwards, forwards and forwards... The aid to reinback seems to be dragging your heels from back to front alternate legs...  how can I describe it???! With a contact (to block) on the same side you're asking with your leg... huh?!
Errrrgh, think I'll have to go to bed... brain fried!
T  x |
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shah
Gold Member
England
1356 Posts |
Posted - 02 Feb 2009 : 08:20:07 AM
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Completely agree with Mrs V - we did that and it made a big difference. Had exactly the same problems as you and it's taken us 2 years to get better... My horse is now at least backing up when asked and we've progressed from 2 steps to as many as I like, but it's still not straight so we've just started practising the corridor, which is great for their brains. It's a brill squeeze too, especially in trot (haven't tried canter yet!).
If you have a sensitive soul you need to be much more aware about your own body weight when reversing. Are you sitting straight, do you have (inadvertedly) more weight in one stirrup or in one hand than the other, are you leaning one way? As soon as I just tilt a little one way my boy will be off in that direction, it's very hard to get rein back straight...... |
West Sussex |
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ella
Gold Member
United Kingdom
786 Posts |
Posted - 03 Feb 2009 : 1:55:11 PM
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Don't try to lift your weight as this can be very restrictive, just take your weight backwards as a cue.
Always wait until his head is dropped before asking for the step back.
Back alongside a fence to help keep straight.
Help him learn to transfer his weight to the hindlegs by backing up hills, in-hand first, then from the saddle when your backing is less resistant.
I bet he can back up without problem if it's his idea to avoid something??? |
   
"If an 'alternative treatment' has reliable effect it becomes classified simply as MEDICINE" D.B. |
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sazzlepants71
Platinum Member
United Kingdom
3536 Posts |
Posted - 04 Feb 2009 : 1:33:42 PM
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hiya , is he reining back on the ground ( in-hand ) perfectly to your voice?
if not , perfect it -inhand with the voice, and once you have that ( with lots of rewards!!!
try the next stage - in the saddle-
i teach mine like this - come down centre line and halt do not tense the body at all sit relaxed and upright in the saddle , swing , gently both legs forward from the knees to the shoulder and then swing back and 'ask' with the voice back , back -
if you get one step thats a result!
then walk forward again , circle , and repeat dont over do it , and dont stress it !
doesnt take them the long to realise that the exagerated 'swinging' means something new!
and it doesnt block them , gradually they accept the leg pressure more and more and you can gradually start to straighten between hand and leg its sounds odd but it works , dennis my sisters horse picked up on the 3rd attempt!
and always reward or have someone on the ground to reward the horse for you, worked for me good luck! x |
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tamila
Platinum Member
England
2532 Posts |
Posted - 04 Feb 2009 : 6:13:35 PM
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| I had this problem with my old man (horse) until I tried Natural Horsemanship and then he did it beautifully even with a bit. |
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Deboniks
Platinum Member
England
3776 Posts |
Posted - 05 Feb 2009 : 8:38:26 PM
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Tamila,don't you mean even without a bit 
It's interesting how we are all different in how we communicate our intentions to our horses.
I do it from the seat to the horses feet,then the legs(in front of the drive line).Getting in time with the horses feet and synchronizing with them works for me.Flame is very good at it and does it without anything on his head,he's an angel
With a sensitive soul go slow and perfect the straightness once he's got the hang of backwards. One trick is to put some treats on a barrel, back him up to the barrel and let him find the treats! It will also teach him to go straight without realizing he's being taught.It will take the pressure off you both and you will both feel good about it after.
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Grey Girl
Platinum Member
England
1554 Posts |
Posted - 06 Feb 2009 : 5:49:01 PM
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I taught Amelia 'Back' to the voice from the ground (I think she already knew it but taught her my signals), and when riding just say 'back'. Last year we spent ages having loads of fun with poles and backing over and between them; she really enjoyed it and after a short while would do the whole pattern on her own from a single 'start' cue.
ACGODFREY: if you horse gets upset with someone on the ground perhaps in the past someone has smacked him from the ground while he was being ridden? My old mare was always very anxious while being ridden if someone on foot starting waving whips about or idly slapping one against their boot (as you do). She couldn't care less if her rider had one, or people waving them if she wasn't being ridden. Turns out at some point in her past she had been smacked into action by someone on the ground when she was being ridden.
Hope this helps. Good luck! If he's arthritic rein back will help to keep his joints free. |
 Said the little eohippus, "I´m going to be a HORSE"  |
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ACGODFREY
Silver Member
United Kingdom
440 Posts |
Posted - 06 Feb 2009 : 7:55:41 PM
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Thanks for all the good ideas everyone! I made the mistake of posting requesting help, then was unable to access AL all week as I am working away at the moment.
My boy backs up in hand, but I think I will incorporate some poles etc. into that so he knows exactly what I want from the ground, before I ask him when ridden.
I like the idea of getting a lesson with a Western person too, just out of curiosity. I've often thought he would be great ridden Western style as he is very responsive to the slightest weight aid etc. and is currently ridden bitless. Anyone know of anyone in Scotland?
Thanks again for the help.
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Chris James
Silver Member
United Kingdom
497 Posts |
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kofihorse
Bronze Member
241 Posts |
Posted - 13 Feb 2009 : 09:07:57 AM
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I use a special "tutting" noise to ask them to go back.
On the ground, I also use poles laid out firstly just two parallel lines then when you can go straight back, in a big "L" shape on the ground. What I do is make sure I am standing straight in front if I want him to go straight back,then move slightly to stand in front of the leg of the side I want him to move away from - do it one step at a time - you do it the opposite way to what you would think, bit like reversing a trailer. They soon pick up your body cues and this exercise is very good for helping them to back out of a trailer slowly and without falling off the ramp. |
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kofihorse
Bronze Member
241 Posts |
Posted - 13 Feb 2009 : 09:10:17 AM
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| Forgot to say that I get him to take the first step back by "walking into" him slowly, with exaggerated steps and touching him on the chest, no pressure at all on the lead rope. |
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