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alistair leslie
Gold Member
England
1036 Posts |
 Posted - 19 Nov 2008 : 10:09:03 AM
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just wondered if this is so .
Is there a better way?
There was a local number to call privately and contributors then posted without giving names ?
Something likr that .
Ideas?
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blue moon |
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angelarab
Platinum Member
Wales
2876 Posts |
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CINDERS
Gold Member
England
750 Posts |
Posted - 19 Nov 2008 : 11:22:28 AM
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Sadly I think the theme of other threads would definitely make people think twice about asking people on here for help, I certainly would not ask now as there is always someone so ready to condemn
IMO we need to respect others decisions when they have a problem and offer help where possible not question or condemn them in what is no doubt a very emotional time
I would love to see a horsey form of samaritans as often just talking can help.. Confidentiality would have to be the key
Yvonne |
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alistair leslie
Gold Member
England
1036 Posts |
Posted - 19 Nov 2008 : 11:37:02 AM
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exactly Cinders.
For example there could be a number to ring with a network back-up as well as the valuable help AL offer here. |
blue moon |
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Roseanne
Moderator
United Kingdom
6708 Posts |
Posted - 19 Nov 2008 : 11:44:41 AM
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I can think of two people who came onto the forum soon after I first joined (about five years ago) and very honestly and genuinely said their circumstances had changed for the worse and they were forced to offer to give away a number of their horses. One became a very good friend of mine who did so out of complete honesty and genuine care for her beloved horses. I remember nothing but sympathy and offers of help at the time.
Things seem to have changed a little over time; I'm not sure quite why. It was undoubtedly a smaller group of Arab people on AL then - though I think it's wonderful that the site and forum are so popular globally now - and these individuals were known and respected by many on the forum.
I can't imagine how a system could be formed to allow people to post their appeals anonymously, unless Admin was prepared to be a go-between on a well-policed 'Welfare' section with offers of help going through Admin. It would be awful if people really didn't feel they could make appeals through this site; where else is there that is such a fast network for help?
Edited to say: In two cases I know of personally in the last two years, I know that Paula has given magnificent support to people in need appealing for help. |
Roseanne |
Edited by - Roseanne on 19 Nov 2008 11:46:57 AM |
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Kirsty5278
Platinum Member
England
2682 Posts |
Posted - 19 Nov 2008 : 11:45:49 AM
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you are full of great ideas - always thinking positive and looking for answers and solutions instead of moaning... run for council!!!
Allistair for Prime Minister!! |
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rosie
Platinum Member
England
3662 Posts |
Posted - 19 Nov 2008 : 12:00:08 PM
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Alistair,
I think you are right - people are frightened to ask for help.
I had a 'wanted ad' on AL, looking to buy an Arab, & I heard some very sad stories, which I won't print but there are people out there needing help.
Lisa |
     
Last picture courtesy of Sweet Photography |
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kimzi
Gold Member
865 Posts |
Posted - 19 Nov 2008 : 1:52:08 PM
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| It would be a fantaastic idea, though who is going to man the phones. In our area (the same one as you alistair) there are people who can be called (the chair of one of the riding clubs - not felstead) and will help without being judgemental but people need to know that those that help are out there and how to contact them. It would be alot easeier if there were less holier than thou types having a go at others in less fortunate circumstances after all horse owners come from all sorts of backgrounds and situations. |
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themewoman
Silver Member
England
375 Posts |
Posted - 19 Nov 2008 : 2:46:59 PM
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| well when i asked for help/advice i got criticised so asked admin to take my thread off. |
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alistair leslie
Gold Member
England
1036 Posts |
Posted - 19 Nov 2008 : 2:48:51 PM
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Thanks Kirsty but my political skills arelike John Seargent's dancing .
I have a belief in the super people we meet in the Arab horse world .
So maybe there is a way as others have said to progress the idea. |
blue moon |
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Pauline
Platinum Member
England
3185 Posts |
Posted - 19 Nov 2008 : 3:31:58 PM
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There will always be people asking for help at all times.
I have and always will offer help and advice if I can, BUT I have been take for a ride a number of times, often spending money I do not have.
If people were honest and careful then we would help but there has been a couple of time recently when I have read the sorry story of people or answered a post for some advice only to find that the story in the end is untrue.
It is human nature for people to criticise or agree but unfortunately it is often on the open forum.
As Al'ers we will help others if we can.
Pauline  |
Pauline Higgs
Equine & Human Holistic Therapist
www.thegentlestouch.co.cc
www.endurancegbmidsouth.co.uk
Berkshire / Hampshire Border |
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pat ww
Platinum Member
United Kingdom
3459 Posts |
Posted - 19 Nov 2008 : 7:04:11 PM
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I did ask for help a few weeks ago, trying to give people who may be able to help plenty of notice. There were quite a few very friendly positive posts, but am still waiting to have any concrete arrangements made for when I have my operation.
My problem should hopefuly be short term, but I for one don't have money in the kitty to pay for a few months care of several horses, in mid winter. I rationalised and offered the mares that are broken to ride on loans, and a rising 3 year old SE colt for loan /lease, and the other for sale. Although I only need a few months help, I am quite prepared for a loaner to have the ridden horses longer to fit in with their own season, or longer.
I think some people do not word their adverts very well, and there are others who people recognise from buying / selling, so that might be where a lack of sympathy / trust comes into play.
Unfortunatly, those who would be 'willing' to help locally just cannot do so due to being my 50+ age group with associated aches and pains, or have 14 odd horses of their own to look after single handed.
An alternative to loaning out would be for a dozen fit people to give up a day to net up a couple of large bale haylage ready for a full week, and fill the water baths. I thought the easier solution was to reduce numbers and let other have some fun with the ones that can be ridden.
I am open to suggestions. |
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Joto
Gold Member
855 Posts |
Posted - 19 Nov 2008 : 8:38:31 PM
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| Hi Pat, sorry I cant offer any practicle hands on help but am wondering if it would be possible to get a local farmer to put out a big bale or 2 of haylage once a week? Ditto water in one of those large round cattle water troughs , and "ranch" the horses out like this until you are fit enough to give individual attention. |
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pat ww
Platinum Member
United Kingdom
3459 Posts |
Posted - 19 Nov 2008 : 9:12:18 PM
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Hi Jill, its not practical for anyone to put out a large bale, as the entire ground is a swamp. It never used to be, but 2 consecutive wet summers/ winters on this clay has changed any simple management system. It has to be netted and hung in the shelters, the only way to let them stand in the dry and eat not paddle on their food. Also they are in small and separate winter paddocks so the fatties don't guzzle food intended for they younger and less pushy nedz. Ive been on these fields since 1992 and its never been like this before. I used to just put it out on the ground, and at the end of winter hardly had anything to rake up.
The other thing is, our 'local farmers' dont exist here. they have all become large livery yards, not a cow or sheep in sight. They wont even deliver haylage unless a min order of ten, no way they'd come to help, even if paid, as they could be earning more on a different job. Its not a kind world any more. I do think though that real country areas are probably more helpful. |
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Pixie
Platinum Member
United Kingdom
6586 Posts |
Posted - 20 Nov 2008 : 10:16:08 AM
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| Oh Patww if feel for you. Wish i could help. Sadly i'm not in a position. Wish you luck though. |
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CINDERS
Gold Member
England
750 Posts |
Posted - 20 Nov 2008 : 11:23:50 AM
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I have not even thought through the practicalities but I would like to see some kind of respite care scheme. There must be many cases where the difficulties are temporary be they health or financial and where with a little thought we could help the people through it. Maybe naively I assume the receipients of this help would then help others when they were able.
As has been said the recue charities are full to bursting and the care at some of these well meaning but underfunded places would seem to be less than perfect. If one signs horses over to them there is no possibility of retrieving them at a later date should you circumstances change for the better
Of course there are people that would abuse the system but better that than the really needy not getting the support they need
What is needed I suppose is s support network. We all also need to take a reality check and sometimes make what is a very hard and personal decision to put to sleep horses that will not be easily rehomed should serious difficulties arise. IMO the rescue charities often keep the very old and the very sick alive a great expense that could be better targeted.
Thank you Alistair for bringing this to the fore, as you and I have discussed this at length for years.
Yvonne |
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Gerri
Platinum Member
England
4211 Posts |
Posted - 20 Nov 2008 : 11:28:39 AM
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Hi Patw, where abouts in the country are you I can't help you personally as in France, but have lots of horse friends around the country, not really arab people but all sorts, will ask around for you, even though cannot promise anything............ but you are right 50 plus years and things start to creep up even if you look young act young and why should we stop having our beloved animals just because now and again our health interferes with the love of having our animals going back to the post........yes on all forums you get people who immediately jump in and stick the knife in, but the good helpful people on here which I have to say I have found the majority of people on here are ready to offer a kind word and helpful advice and support makes asking for help on here worth while, so for me, with the risk of being shot down in flames, I would still ask for help and those few negative people would not put me off |
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pat ww
Platinum Member
United Kingdom
3459 Posts |
Posted - 20 Nov 2008 : 2:32:00 PM
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Hi Gerri, thanks for the thought, if you know anyone up north, I am on the Wirral, Merseyside.
I do think a network for short term support owuld be invaluable, and yes, if I could I would help others. There should never be a one way road. Last time I did it individually by getting Sibs away from a dreadful situation, and now he has a terrific home with Lynn.
We should all do what we can, you never know when it might be you. |
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MinHe
Platinum Member
England
2927 Posts |
Posted - 20 Nov 2008 : 6:58:55 PM
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Pat, I feel awful, I would love to help you as I really understand your problem (been there, got the t-shirt), but we are pushed to the limit with our own and being realistic I couldn't take on another horse as even though we now have helpers, we don't have enough land over the winter (on clay, like you)  . So very, very sorry...
Keren |
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Tonim
Silver Member
United Kingdom
430 Posts |
Posted - 20 Nov 2008 : 7:37:39 PM
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| It is sad that people no longer feel they can ask for help on here as they are scared of a possible backlash. I guess it's because there has been a minority who have abused people's good nature. But there are a lot of genuine people on this forum who really would do all they can to help, so please don't be put off asking. |
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loppy loo
Bronze Member
England
56 Posts |
Posted - 20 Nov 2008 : 9:16:54 PM
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Hi All, It's lovely to see there are some of you willing to give help, not critisism.
I have always given my time and sometimes money if I have it, to help anyone, but never found it easy to ask for help especially if I can just plod on and hope for the best. I have helped out certain people recently and who know the situation but am getting no support back so I have advertised the horses for sale or loan and wasted lot's of time emailing and talking to possible new owners just to be let down or not hear back. So my main problem at the moment is affording the horses as my partner has lost his job but if/when he finds a job and the financial situation gets better I won't have him there to look after my two young children for me to go to the yard as much as is needed (i expect those of you who do like to criticise will be thinking "just take the kids with you"! but if you knew them you would know the oldest is a complete scardy cat so screams when the horses go near her and the youngest is hoodini and gets out of the pram or any where and runs off or gets under the horses. Not to mention it being winter so not really a good time to have them hanging around in the wet and cold). Basically I can't win no matter what, hence my decision to let them go. As the selling or loaning hasn't been successful and the financial situation getting desperate I am having to choose to feed the kids rather than the horses and with one in foal and the others being young it is not ideal. They are rugged and have a large round bale of hay in the field at all times. I have never had to be so tight in all my years with horses so if you think this is ok for them until things get better please let me know just to put my mind at rest or I had another idea of finding a sharer to go halves with everything to hopefully take the strain off.
Any help/advice/ideas would be much appreciated.
I can also say I would give 200% as much as I can to help anyone in anyway I can.
Thanks
Lisa
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pat ww
Platinum Member
United Kingdom
3459 Posts |
Posted - 20 Nov 2008 : 10:05:48 PM
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Hi Lisa, been there with kids in the past, its far from ideal taking them, they could end up resenting you. Fortunatley my dad had retired, and he was making up for the lost time he did not have with us when we we were younger and the working day was 8 am - 6 pm with a minimum one hours travel each way. I know its not as easy these days for grandparents to step in, they have to work or families live further apart.
Out with haylage should not do them any harm, if your in foal mare is in OK condition its only the last third of the pregnancy that takes any serious demand on her body when she does need more quality. If they've got haylage to chomp through without being short the youngsters will probably do fine on it. Most horses are over fed and it just gets passed out or makes them fat or fizzy.
My two year old colt has never been in, he's had a shelter but never rugged. He's mums first foal and is bigger than her now, a very solid looking boy! We joke he's my Welsh cob, so it doesn't do them any harm being out. Put your mind at rest. |
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loppy loo
Bronze Member
England
56 Posts |
Posted - 20 Nov 2008 : 10:12:23 PM
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Thanks Pat WW
I decided to rug so the little food they do get keeps them heathly instead of using it for warmth so with the extra hay they should keep condition. The mare actually looks very well compared to when I had her with foal at foot. |
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pat ww
Platinum Member
United Kingdom
3459 Posts |
Posted - 20 Nov 2008 : 10:23:51 PM
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| Rosas 2 best winters were the twice she was pregnant, she always dropped condition despite being fed and rugged. I think their hormones cause them to use their food more efficiently when pregnant. |
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suyents
Platinum Member
United Kingdom
1651 Posts |
Posted - 22 Nov 2008 : 7:05:00 PM
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well, i've given a lot of thought before contributing to this thread, but several years ago i can honestly say that i believe i was the first person to "go public" about no longer being able to afford to look after my horses in the way that i wished to. i wrote a letter to the AHS Magazine and put a very lengthy thread on here asking for help..(nothing new there!!). Paula was, as always, very supportive. Not so everyone else. Although i was offered many homes, not all of them were suitable, and people became very unpleasant when i did not jump at the chance to give them my horses. i had lots of abuse about wanting to rehome my veteran mares and in the end i didn't. one of them is still with me and the other sadly had to be destroyed when she broke her leg; it could be argued that if i had been able to find her a home with better ground she might still be alive today. no matter. For the record, it takes a great deal of courage and desparation and humilty to ask for help on a public forum, and to be ostrasized and critisized when you are already feeling pretty miserable and depressed really doesn't add up to anything positive. My heart goes out to anyone who has to part with creatures that have become an integral part of their lives as the decision is never lightly made.....Nowadays, when there are so many people ready to jump on the band-wagon and judge, it is even more daunting a prospect. There was a time when i tried to co-ordinate AID..Arabs in Distress...when i win a lottery, i will do so still.
suyen |
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