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joanna_piana
Platinum Member
 United Kingdom
3935 Posts |
 Posted - 08 Sep 2008 : 12:36:25 PM
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If you were to buy a horse straight from the breeder and not having done anything yet what sort of vetting would you get? And in fact what are the different sorts to choose from?
Previously I've not had any of mine vetted as Shida i'd had on loan for six months before I bought her, Rioja i'd known from a foal and Ash was only cheap so didn't seem worth it.
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Harthall Rashida RIP, Binley Ishara, Bouchan
Chorleywood, Hertfordshire |
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Adara_Arabians
Gold Member
England
736 Posts |
Posted - 08 Sep 2008 : 12:42:05 PM
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| you can go from 1-5* vettings, if i was to purchase from the breeder at a young age i would prob have a 2* as this will just check the bitals, i.e flexion test, sight and soundness. 5* is very intense with ridden, lunging and blood tests ect. |
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Bexandspooky
Silver Member
England
332 Posts |
Posted - 08 Sep 2008 : 1:04:32 PM
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| Same as above - so does this mean that you have your eye on something!? |
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Adara_Arabians
Gold Member
England
736 Posts |
Posted - 08 Sep 2008 : 1:07:42 PM
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may i just add something that has always puzzled me, Most horses I have ever sold has had a vetting done, what puzzled me is the competion horses had a 5* vetting done. So they also take a blood test which they send in the post, although they tell the owner within an hour or so whether the horse passed or not.
What frightens me is, if i have a horse vetted and it has been given bute or something? does this show up in the blood test? i would assume so, so why do they pass before getting the results?
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kimzi
Gold Member
865 Posts |
Posted - 08 Sep 2008 : 1:50:13 PM
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| Yep bute will show up, as will acp, sedolin, ketamine and many other pharms. Our vets test at the surgery so no post required, but even with a 2 stage we insist on bloods being takemn and then stored incase the temperament drastically changes. |
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Pasha
Platinum Member
England
3622 Posts |
Posted - 08 Sep 2008 : 2:01:48 PM
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| I agree, if I was buying a youngster I would only have a 2* (would be impossible to complete a 5* I think if it wasn't of riding age), although I would always have bloods done and x-rays! I have had experience with too many horror stories with close friends not to! I'd rather waste £500 on x-rays but know I was getting a sound, injury free horse than find-out it had something life threatening or could never be ridden 6 months down the line! It would depend though - I doubt a 6 month old would have anything dramatic that wouldn't show itself on a 2* |
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loulou
Silver Member
England
464 Posts |
Posted - 08 Sep 2008 : 2:39:21 PM
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| Hi Kimzi is absolutely right. They normally store the blood for a set amount of time and if the horse goes lame, changes temperament etc they will then test for bute, acp,s etc. |
    
Essex |
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Delyth
Gold Member
United Kingdom
1425 Posts |
Posted - 08 Sep 2008 : 2:46:14 PM
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| I hate vettings as they are only as good as the vet doing them !! Last 5 stage vetting we had here the vet pushed far too hard and I called a stop to it. Sometimes I think they are just hell bent on finding something whether there is anything wrong or not. Then he told me nothing actually passes a vetting there is something wrong with every horse and it was up to him to find it - git !! |
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Kash
Platinum Member
England
3777 Posts |
Posted - 08 Sep 2008 : 3:00:59 PM
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I had my mare vetted prior to purchasing her and I believe it was a 2* vetting. She was an unbacked 6 year old mare who had been imported some years earlier, had since bred a foal and shown inhand.
Although I was told as much of her history as possible and she came from the loveliest stud, I just wanted peace of mind as she's my One
Good luck!
Lauren
PS Just had a thought, and have PM'D you |
      
Photographs by Emma Maxwell and Peter Grant |
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Dot
Gold Member
England
669 Posts |
Posted - 08 Sep 2008 : 3:04:36 PM
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theoretically the vet you saw was right no horse passes a 5* vetting as their is no such thing as a perfect horse. Personally I am not a great believer in flexion tests for all sorts of reasons.
Call me a chancer but I have never had a horse vetted that I have bought my reasons being.
Horse 1: was free and no vetting would have shown it was developing brain problems. Owned for about 4 months.
Horse 2: cost me £650 was 6 yeas old and had detached suspensories, did get full vet work up on injuries. Owned for 6 years and competed up to 50 miles in endurance and 3.75 in flat racing.
Horse 3: Bought as privately owned unbacked 18 month old, saw previous 2* vetting at 6 months. Only being sold due to owners illness. Now 6 and I still own him, competed up to 64 km.
Horse 4: 9 year old, done nothing for 3 years, only paid £1000 for it and knew its past competition history. Came via a very well known friend / dealer who had sold him previously out of racing 3 years previously. I sw the vetting card from then and passed this onto his new owner. Owned for 4 years competed up to 120km in ER's, now with Polly Wells.
Horse 5: bought as a 12 year old mare from a friend, had known the horse for about 6 years on and off. Saw no reason to vet as ultimately was buying her as a broodmare with a bitt of ridden fun in the mean time. She had a proven record as a brood mare, 4 foals.
Horse 6: Was an unbacked 8 year old stallion, bought from breeder. In 8 months of riding took from unbacked to 80km, never lame, sadly killed earlier this year. Saw no reason to vet as knew source and why he was unbacked.
Horse 7: I bred it and it is only 5 months old.
Either I am very lucky or very lucky or maybe but I doubt it very much a good judge of horses.
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Dot
www.threelowsfarm.com
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Adara_Arabians
Gold Member
England
736 Posts |
Posted - 08 Sep 2008 : 3:14:38 PM
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| Alaska, i spotted a slight problem a month or two after i purchased her, in her hind fetlock. On having a flexion test some weeks later, she had a hairline problem and will never bother her. 4years later she has been retired and comes up hoping lane on a flexion test. I have never ever regretted buying her and even after only having a few years out of her dont regret it. i have had plenty that i have sold vetted and even found faults with the vets. I hadnt obviusly butted them, but i just think they should test the blood and then give the result before passing a horse, if they can afford to pay out for the 5* then they should have the full results. In answer, i would have my horse vetted the next time i buy to avoid the same problem and another lawn mower in 4yrs, however I will make up my own mind how i feel about the vetting at the time |
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Info Sponge
Bronze Member
England
182 Posts |
Posted - 08 Sep 2008 : 4:33:58 PM
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Hi,
Just thought you might be interested in my own experience.
I agreed to buy a foal at ten days old from its breeder. The breeder's web site advertised that the youngstock were all wormed regularly and vacinated and I discussed the vacinations with the breeder prior to agreeeing to purchase and was told that the foal would have all its necessary tetenus injections. I agreed to pay the full asking price for the foal on condition that it satisfactorily passed a vets inspection at six months and I would then have the foal shortly after when it was weaned.
I was a little surprised to be asked to arrange and fully pay for the full insurance of the foal inclusive of vet's fees for the six month's prior to its delivery. Although I thought this was a somewhat one sided request, as if the foal failed its vetting I would have been down £500 for the period due to the deposit and would have paid to insure a third party's horse for that time I complied with this request despite encountering a lot of hassle from the NFU who insisted that the foal was insured in both my own and the breeder's name even though I was having to fully pay for the policy. However, I was extremely disappointed when the breeder insisted I also paid for her own time as well as the vet's after the vetting (2 Stage) took place depite being able to have the vetting at her own convenience. I was also then asked to pay for the tetnus injections. It was not the money it was the principal I was basically being held to ransom having been told that if I didn't pay the extra money I wouldn't have the foal.
I am someone who buys a horse once every thirty years and it becomes my friend for its life so I was extremely excited to be getting my new horse having waited some six months for it. To be told I could not have it unless I paid this extra money the day before it was due to be delivered was quite upsetting. I did not know whether the foal was going to be delivered or not and it totally ruined what should have been a very happy ocasion.
Whilst I knew that legally I could have stood my ground and would have still eventually acquired the foal having taken the breeder to court as I had paid a good deposit and had the agreed sale price in writing I paid the extra money as requested.
The sad thing is, that had the breeder at the outset told me she wanted payment for her time and the injections I would have probably been quite happy to agree to it and would have thought no more about it. As it turned out my husband was absolutely furious and I have never seen my son so cross as when he heard what had happened. Its funny really how these little things can really spoil things.
Anyhow that is now well behind us and we are very happy with the foal itself. So just a warning make sure you know exactly what the price is.
Hope you find your new friend soon. |
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joanna_piana
Platinum Member
United Kingdom
3935 Posts |
Posted - 08 Sep 2008 : 4:42:12 PM
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| Interesting, thanks for all your comments. I guess a lot is down to luck really. Afterall you could buy something have it pass a 5* vetting and then it could get kicked in the field when you get it home. I guess the main thing is insurance but think i'll probably get vetted too. Anyway just planning ahead! |
Harthall Rashida RIP, Binley Ishara, Bouchan
Chorleywood, Hertfordshire |
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jasjmm
Gold Member
625 Posts |
Posted - 08 Sep 2008 : 6:23:18 PM
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Hi Info Sponge (!)
Sounds like someone was completely taking the michael re your foal. Surely a deposit paid until weaning is normal? I understand its difficult if you really want the foal though, but that sounds pretty over the top, fee-wise.
I've always had horses vetted, simply because I can't know what's going on on the inside and if there is anything that is obvious to a vet, but wouldn't be to me, then I'd like to know up front. I'm sure its not infallible, as people have said, but at least from a buyer's point of view you are covering yourself as far as you can. |
    
Bristol |
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phoenixbruka
Gold Member
England
1190 Posts |
Posted - 08 Sep 2008 : 7:12:21 PM
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I've never had a horse vetted as I always buy youngsters... perhaps I've been lucky ??
My older boy (16) got him at 3 and he's still happily pootleing about with me doing showing and dressage , ok hes got cushings but hey ho , he didnt have it when he was a baby
My new boy is 3, had him on loan for 3 months prior to purchase,found out he's got LV but it didn't stop me buying him ( although I'd NEVER loan again with the hassle I've had with his previous owners!!  )
My mare ( now sold ) I bought at an hour old foal   |
   
www.liveryatcordwell.co.uk |
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pat ww
Platinum Member
United Kingdom
3459 Posts |
Posted - 08 Sep 2008 : 8:30:18 PM
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Had our kids first pony - pure bred mare - vetted as I had been out of horses for about 14 years, and our first colt that we wanted to keep entire so we would know he'd pass the stallion licence.
Not bothered with the Welsh ponies, had been hardy broodmares and it was temperament that was more important, the little work they get on lead rein they could do on 3 legs.
Only one buyer from me has had a horse vetted, they wanted her for endurance and she was unbroken, they were vets who bought her so did it when they came to see her. Non of my home bred horses have been vetted by buyers, because they were sold very cheaply to people I could trust to give them the best possible home, its worked so far. |
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Offira
Platinum Member
England
1583 Posts |
Posted - 08 Sep 2008 : 9:08:19 PM
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I think I would prob go for a Two stage if paying a reasonable amount of money and planning a riding future.
Over the years I have had mixed fortunes with vettings - one horse passed with flying colours but within 6 months developed pedal ostitis and another passed and was later found to have a long-standing kissing spine. The one I purchased despite him failing the vetting I have had 29 trouble free years! |
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Pauline
Platinum Member
England
3185 Posts |
Posted - 08 Sep 2008 : 9:31:00 PM
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Bought my first pony aged 3 unvetted went on to live until he was 26 yrs did everything from pony club and hunted for 20 yrs
Next horse was given so again not vetted
No3 bought as a ten yr old very cheaply went on to live until he was 28yrs completed 15 years at endurance
No4 Bought from the breeder as a yearling knew his history
No5 Given to me still competeing at 18 yrs
No6 Rescued her and payed very little for her.
No7 Hopefully will be breeding my next one
Maybe I've been lucky but have never had a horse vetted and never had a problem.
Pauline  |
Pauline Higgs
Equine & Human Holistic Therapist
www.thegentlestouch.co.cc
www.endurancegbmidsouth.co.uk
Berkshire / Hampshire Border |
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lisa rachel
Gold Member
Wales
831 Posts |
Posted - 08 Sep 2008 : 9:47:56 PM
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Don't really want to get into this too deeply but a couple of things...
There is no such thing as a 1,2,3,4 or 5* vetting
As vets we have a choice to offer a 2 or 5 STAGE vetting depending on owners wishes, age of horse etc.
The stages are laid down in clear guidelines for us they are ( very breifly described here...)
Stage 1 examination in box of skin eyes(with ophthalmoscope) heart limbs mouth etc
Stage 2 conformation, trot up rein back +/- flexion tests lunging etc
Ok so that is a 2 stage, if we continue...
Stage 3 vigorous exercise under saddle for heart, wind etc
Stage 4 rest in box to draw horse, pull blood and observe for vices etc
Stage 5 second trot up +/- flexion to see if horse has stiffened up or shown any lameness after exercise then rest.
That is a 5 stage!!!
Endoscopy radiography etc can be used to suppliment the proceedure if required.
It is our job to find any abnormalities then DISCUSS THE RELEVANCE of these with the purchaser with specific reference to the intended use of the horse. eg A condition which may prejudice an animals use for eventing would be of no significance in a hack for example.
Finally We (the vets in our practice) HATE 'failing' horses ... the purchaser is disappointed and the vendor anything from disapointed to vicious... yep we have had pretty vicious from time to time!!!
BUT the bottom line is it is our job to thoroughly and diligently examine the animal to alert the purchaser (who at that point is our client) to any abnormalities which may affect.....
The ability of the horse to do his intended job
The insurabilty of the animal
Any possible resale where another vet may take a more different view of a given condition.
So no we are NOT out to fail horses quite the opposite.. if they pass everyone is happy... all we are trying to do is thorough job and given an honest opinion.
I won't even start on flexion tests!!!
Cheers
Lisa |
lisa |
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jaj
Platinum Member
United Kingdom
4324 Posts |
Posted - 08 Sep 2008 : 10:05:35 PM
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I paid for a 5 stage vetting as K was quite expensive. It was very thorough and the results reported that she was 'green, fat and unfit' I decided I could live with that  !
Jen
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Kuraishiya (Maleik el Kheil/Kazra el Saghira) and Sahara Bey (Kuraishiya/WSA Charismma) |
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s.jade
Platinum Member
United Kingdom
2401 Posts |
Posted - 08 Sep 2008 : 10:06:09 PM
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I must admit I've gone with my gut instinct and so far not had any vetted.
However, I arranged for my precious Fabbi to be vetted, althougth I'd known her for 3 years as had worked with her - only because we were into 5 figures in buying her!!
The day before the vetting she threw a shoe - hopping lame, no way we could vet
It came down to....another buyer was waiting to snap her up (well, 2!) so do I go for it without the vetting, or risk them ebating me to her? I took a risk and brought her home unvetted
I had to have my 3yr old colt 5* vetted for his lisence, he had to work very hard, I think it's a bit much for a baby to be honest, I'd got for a 2* if a younsgter, 5* for a ridden horse. |
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