| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| saddlebred |
Posted - 29 May 2009 : 7:07:18 PM
I have managed to buy the whole set of palomino magazines from the early 1950's and have come across some extra pictures of this fabulous old foundation stallion. There is a an old thread in the archive where Rozyrider did some research around the bloodlines if anyone is interested.
On the headshot Golden Trail is said to be 21 years old.
 |
| 25 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| D |
Posted - 18 Dec 2009 : 10:54:39 PM
My friend of years ago had Monclare Morning Coffee and I bought her colt foal by Ruslan. He was born in 1978 and was registered as Golden Orient. Coffee had 3 fillies - all (I think) had the Monclare prefix, but as much as I try I can't remember their registered names or who they were by (it's an age thing - I'm sorry). One was a chesnut who may have been called Monclare Morning Sunshine, and two palomino fillies (Lady and Goldie) who were full sisters - stallion was Esgotsby ?????? Don't know if any of this info is useful to you. Just thought I would add to it. I do have pictures somewhere!! (Also a few Palomino magazines from the late 70's early 80's. |
| Rozy Rider |
Posted - 06 Dec 2009 : 6:56:47 PM
Sunshine might have been at Shepley in 1966, but she was back with Mrs Munday at Monclare in 1973, to record Monclare Arabian King. Very pally these lot were just maybe they were swopping them around.
I was there the day the Stallion Grassendale Golden Rocket arrived at Shepley..that takes me back.
Sue
MONCLARE ARABIAN KING pal H 1973 RISSLAN SUNSHINE77 PALOMINO Edit
MONCLARE ARABIAN REIGN C BLUE RAINBOW SUNSHINE77 PART-BRED ARAB Edit
MONCLARES ARABIAN GOLD pal M 1969 AKRAM5 SUNSHINE77 PALOMINO Edit
MORNING COFFEE2 pal M 1970 ORIENT MASQUE SUNSHINE77 PART-BRED ARAB Edit
SHEPLEY SUNDANCER pal M 1966 WIDDICOMBE FAIR SUNSHINE77 PALOMINO
|
| Melynda |
Posted - 06 Dec 2009 : 1:06:59 PM
I've looked through the Hunter Stud Books from 1930-1973 and the only horse entered with the breeder Mr E. A. Bayliss is Ashley Golden Sandstone
http://www.sporthorse-data.com/db.php?i=10580405&time=1260104534
Unfoutunately there is no mention of her dam.
He is not registerd as a HIS member during any of the years 1930-73 so I presume he must have bred unregistered hunters.
The only mare registered with the name Fiona in the Hunter Stud Books was born 1969 and belonging to someone else. |
| saddlebred |
Posted - 06 Dec 2009 : 10:49:47 AM
This is Golden Sapho
Apologies for poor quality but it is from a very old fragile magazine. |
| saddlebred |
Posted - 06 Dec 2009 : 10:24:46 AM
Re: Ashley Golden Olga
I have got this photo of her which was part of a 1961 article but it is not likely that she was New Forest. The article reads:
"Ashley Stud owned by Mr. E A Bayliss situated on the edge of the pretty village of Luckington in Wiltshire, about 3 miles from Badminton" " Mr Baylis told us that the stud had been founded by him in the early 30's for the breeding and showing of hunters and hacks. It was not until 1935, however that he decided to concentrate on palomino breeding only, particularly the larger palominos" "The broodmares now at the stud are Ashley Golden Olga believed to be of German origin who joined the stud in 1940 and is still an active matron aged 29 years. Olga has produced several palominos, probably the most memorable being the palomino gelding Ashley Colden Trigger the showjumper,also the palomino gelding Ashely Golden Pickles, the palomino filly Asheley Golden Trixie, and the palomino gelding Ashley Golden Skyrocket. All these palominos were sired by Golden Trail."
 |
| saddlebred |
Posted - 06 Dec 2009 : 10:07:23 AM
Just to confirm that Sunshine (Takamirs Biscuit/Golden Sapho was definitely with Mrs. Collings at the Shepley Stud in 1966. She is listed as one of their mares at stud. It lists her as being due to Grassendale Golden Rocket for 1967 with a 1966 pally filly at foot by Widdicombe Fair. |
| Rozy Rider |
Posted - 13 Nov 2009 : 11:37:10 AM
There are bits missing, as you can see, for some reason the USA had difficulty finding and confirming some of those spaces, I think the records only went back so far..and thats what we've got. About the 25%,basically I have no idea, his pedigree came from USA and they confirmed it,we were so pleased to get what we have, so we believe it to be correct. The only thing I can think, without getting someone like Bia to search through the listed breeding is, that any offsprings he had would need to have 12.1/2% minimum Arab blood to get the AHS registry, so lets hope he is 25%.
Sue |
| kastell |
Posted - 12 Nov 2009 : 1:00:13 PM
Hi Rozy Rider, just looked at the info bit & I have a question, how is he 25%+ Arab when the only Arab I can see in his pedigree is Sargon, which would only make him 12.5% Arab? Or is there some bits missing on the pedigree? Just curious! |
| Rozy Rider |
Posted - 12 Nov 2009 : 11:51:54 AM
This info is on the link and on page 1.
http://www.allbreedpedigree.com/golden+trail3
Sue |
| kastell |
Posted - 08 Nov 2009 : 7:18:14 PM
Hi all great reading especially about Sylvia, as she's in my mares pedigree too! In respect of Golden Trail, what % Arab is he (registered % & un-reg % if any?), just out of interest really.
|
| dormouse |
Posted - 06 Nov 2009 : 1:33:17 PM
Ashley prefix for New Forest's is used by Mr & Mrs W O Dibden or Dibdin depending on where it is printed. They live somewhere around the New Forest area.
Suzy |
| Rozy Rider |
Posted - 02 Nov 2009 : 3:33:06 PM
Hi, All Can anyone help with a New Forest pony mare( hope so with a name like olga). In the breeding for Sunshine.(above)
Ashley Golden Olga. UK and New Forest Pony and going back a wnile..anyone got any cue's who's refix ASHLEY was.
Thanks Sue
and more photo's to come very soon, I understand... |
| Rozy Rider |
Posted - 30 Oct 2009 : 11:27:49 PM
Hi, It was good to hear from you. I spoke to Mrs Munday to confirm the breeding earlier in the year, so I believe it to be correct, and it looks Ok on allbreeds at the mo.
Although,
The Data S. link still has no Golden Trail or Golden Olga listed..pity.http://www.sporthorse-data.com/d?i=10555027
Pity no one turned up a pic of Sunshine.
Thank you whoever you are who updated the Data S..for Sunshine.. and Its Mrs Munday.
Cheers Sue |
| sarahlock |
Posted - 30 Oct 2009 : 7:13:11 PM
Hi there , thanks for correcting it & yes that`s the Sunshine we put on the All Breeds when we were tracing Palomino bloodlines but people keep changing it , i had to change it back 6 months ago as it had been tampered with ! |
| knedo_stables |
Posted - 29 Oct 2009 : 10:08:26 PM
Originally posted by Rozy RiderHi all, Leaving you the link to Golden Trail. This is the pedigree we believe to be correct. I contacted the USA and they would only say that there records only go back to 1980. Goodness knows what they did before that date, as Golden Trial was born in 1946, quite some time prior to 1980. He's got loads of progeny listed on the all breeds site, well worth a look and he obviously was a very popular palomino horse of those times.(Just a bit before my own Palonino times, as I was born the year before.) http://www.allbreedpedigree.com/golden+trail3--------------------------------------------------------- Just to add, while were back on the Palomino trial, I did find that the records on allbreeds were not correct for MONCLARE ARABIAN KING , I believe this horse's dam is/was SUNSHINE - Cremello Mare. 1958. sire Takamirs Biscuit, dam Golden Sappho. and I'm leaving you the correct link for this cremello mare( it was not the palomino mare No54). http://www.allbreedpedigree.com/sunshine77I also believe she was stationed with Mrs Munday at Monclare Stud. I've kept all my notes from the last time we looked at these horses. Anyone got the PBAR Vol. VI, I'd like to know what page she's on and what other Monclare ponies are listed there. Thanks Sue. |
| Rozy Rider |
Posted - 11 Aug 2009 : 1:19:17 PM
Last night I looked at the archived records of this subject and its all there. Just almost fell asleep at the computer will look it up again later.Vaniety Fair and Widdicombe Fair are the references we are interested in, I think. Nimlat had entered the page no (60) and there are other entries that confirm where we got the information from in the first place. There are other family members that might help us to..the Westwoods bred several of there own horses, all along the same lines... I think these horses were TB and not half bred and would like to check that out before going off on a tangent..
Vaniety Fair was well shown around and did quite a bit of winning as a hack. should not be to difficult to find her entered in some of the bigger show cats..
Its under Sundowner 1961. dated 6.10.2007 - Archived now...
Sue |
| Info Sponge |
Posted - 11 Aug 2009 : 1:06:47 PM
Thanks Sue & Melynda!
I've been looking on the TB Heritage site and comparing names on the allbreed records which has left me totally confused so I think I will leave it again to you the experts.
However, I did glean from those records that there was a TB at about the right time called Yellow Rose as opposed to Yellow Roses if that helps.
 Just amended my earlier post as I spelt Ruddygore with an 'i' instead of a 'y'
Thanks again.
Chris |
| Melynda |
Posted - 11 Aug 2009 : 12:31:09 PM
I am away on holiday at present but will look details up in the GSB's when I get back.
|
| Rozy Rider |
Posted - 10 Aug 2009 : 6:54:47 PM
Hi I'm not tottally convinced that the Ruddigore part of the TB breeding is quite correct, I think there is a hiccup with the year. You will see that the GB is missing from some member of that line. But, I need to go back and do a check on the years. The horse should be in the TB stud book and the date of birth needs checking, once thats entered correctely it should all fall into place.
ANYONE have the Thoroughbred Stud books...for the turn of the century. 1920 1930 1940's and can help us please...
Sue |
| Info Sponge |
Posted - 08 Aug 2009 : 11:16:03 AM
Thanks Sue for those links. I had printed out the all breed general family tree for Widdicombe Fair and for some reason it didn't show the Ruddygore part of the breeding which I see is included in the dedicated thoroughbred family tree.
Really pleased about this gap being filled! I think now I only need to find the background of Fiona the Palomino & Silvia which are both in Silver Moonlight's breeding.
Must say I am totally impressed with the excellant service you are all providing!!!
Thanks again.
Chris |
| Rozy Rider |
Posted - 07 Aug 2009 : 11:56:10 PM
Thanks Melynda.
Chris, what was the Mr Toots Mare saga ???. I remeber it was in the breeding, what was the querie...
here is the link.
http://www.pedigreequery.com/mr+toots+mare
http://www.pedigreequery.com/widdicombe+fair
Sue |
| Melynda |
Posted - 06 Aug 2009 : 8:06:22 PM
Does it say where SYLVIA VI won her Premium in 1955.??
Sorry but didn't see this question.
It only says 1955. Premium H.I.S. after her details. |
| Info Sponge |
Posted - 06 Aug 2009 : 5:11:52 PM
Hi everyone,
As I started 'the Golden trail'thread of 2007 I thought I'd just say thank you for the fabulous photo! I'm also still very interested in Sylvia & of course the elusive Mr Toots Mare saga if anyone knows more.
You may be amused to see some familar names if you look at all breeds data on Red Rum & Yeats!
Best regards,
Chris |
| Rozy Rider |
Posted - 24 Jul 2009 : 3:03:16 PM
Melynda, Does it say where SYLVIA VI won her Premium in 1955.??
Thanks Sue |
| Rozy Rider |
Posted - 21 Jul 2009 : 01:11:09 AM
This is an interesting bit of Melynda's reserch from 2007, regarding MayfairIII. Also note that Mt Sun Tan was born in 1956, so there was also a chestnutcolt of the same breeding foaled in 1955.
Both Mayfair III and Fleche Bleu were owned by J. H. Wheatley, Forge Stud, Twycross, Atherstone, Warwickshire. Mayfair III travelled to Leicestershire, Fleche Bleu to Essex, Leicetershire and Staffordshire.
Mayfair III 1950 - 12 mares - 3 foals
1951 no figures in stud book
1952 - 78 mares - 55 foals
1953 - 64 mares - 42 foals
1954 - 5 mares - 5 foals then sustituted for Noble Manna
1955 - no figures in book
1956 - no figures in book
1957 - 58 mares - 31 foals
1958/59 no more figures in book
Fleche Bleu 1959 - 84 mares - 43 foals (Essex)
1960 - 95 mares - 64 foals (Leics.)
1961 - 108 mares - 63 foals (Leics.)
1962 - 83 mares - 43 foals (Leics.)
1963 - 79 mares - 52 foals (Staffs.)
Have only got the books up to 1963 (any newer books would be gladly bought. Fleche Bleue died March 1970.
As Mayfair has not got any stud records for 1955 I am wondering if the chestnut colt of 1955 could be Mr Sun Tan??? or perhaps he could just have been used privately in 1955.
There are no breed details for Sylvia VI.
Sue |
