| Author |
 Topic  |
|
|
nn
Gold Member
England
659 Posts |
 Posted - 16 Feb 2011 : 2:51:27 PM
|
As most of you know i have gone down the path of grading my AA horses as trakehners.
At the recent grading in Germany an anglo arab stallion graded into the main trakehner stud book.
He was presented with 14 other trakehner stallions and is one of only three that graded.
A brilliant achivment for the breed.
There is a video of him on youtube. Ismahn.
Might enquire about him as a husband for Lady Arabella next year, she is having another go with Fairlyn Gemini this year for the elusive colt 
Nicky
|
       |
|
Report to moderator
|
|
|
BabsR
Platinum Member
England
2790 Posts |
Posted - 16 Feb 2011 : 3:22:40 PM
|
Thats good news Nicky......considering the German Horses are viewed some of the best in the World....nice to see an Anglo stallion holding his own and beating the majority forward, for grading into their Main Trakehner Stud Book
Not that I am biased...but you simply cannot beat a GOOD ANGLO ARAB as an all round competition horse, whatever the discipline!!!
Babs
www.SunrayAngloArabianStud.co.uk |
        |
Report to Moderator  |
|
|
Roseanne
Moderator
United Kingdom
6708 Posts |
Posted - 16 Feb 2011 : 3:26:26 PM
|
Forgive my ignorance Nicky but would that AA be a 50% purebred? I still can't quite get my head around this Anglo/partbred thingie...
Great achievement for the breed though. |
Roseanne |
| Report to Moderator |
|
|
nn
Gold Member
England
659 Posts |
Posted - 16 Feb 2011 : 3:42:16 PM
|
Hi Roseanne
Not sure on his percentage but i am sure that someone on here will check it out
Anglo arabs dont have to have 50% they just need to be of pure arab and TB blood.
Partbreds have arab and other blood in them.
The trakehners are a closed stud book like the AHS, but they occasionally grade arab, TB or AA blood in to keep the breed elegant and hardy.
Think that helps
Nicky |
|
| Report to Moderator |
|
|
Roseanne
Moderator
United Kingdom
6708 Posts |
Posted - 16 Feb 2011 : 3:47:53 PM
|
| Just goes to show, they'll always need to use Arab blood to reinforce strength and beauty!! |
Roseanne |
| Report to Moderator |
|
|
BabsR
Platinum Member
England
2790 Posts |
Posted - 16 Feb 2011 : 4:02:04 PM
|
Ismahn is sired by Markek a Trekehner and out of an Anglo Arab Mare Inka by Bouquet who is also an Anglo Arab.
Not able to work out the percentage of Pure Arab Blood unless I had his full pedigree details
A very handsome chap....very elegant and certainly bascules well over his jumps
Not sure if he would be acceptable for registry in AHS Anglo Stud Books as his pedigree history contains Shagya Arabian bloodlines which if I remember reading elsewhere, some of which are not 100% Pure Arabian
Babs
www.SunrayAngloArabianStus.co.uk |
|
| Report to Moderator |
|
|
Sabine K
Bronze Member
130 Posts |
|
|
Lynda
Platinum Member
England
1957 Posts |
Posted - 16 Feb 2011 : 5:56:26 PM
|
That is great news for the Anglo Arabs.
Just a little query! Are the Anglos in Germany the same as the British Anglos i.e. a cross between Arab and Thoroughbred bloodlines only, with no other bloodlines allowed? |
| Report to Moderator |
|
|
nn
Gold Member
England
659 Posts |
Posted - 16 Feb 2011 : 6:02:21 PM
|
As far as i am aware the AA in Germany is the same as the AA over here.
However they do seem to have Shagya blood in there pedigree.
So are they AA?
The trakehner rules say they will only grade arab, TB and AA into there closed stud book. But the shagya debate obviously isnt a problem for them!
Nicky |
|
| Report to Moderator |
|
|
Sabine K
Bronze Member
130 Posts |
Posted - 16 Feb 2011 : 6:08:58 PM
|
Shagya blood is allowed as well
Anglos out of Arab and TB crossings are Anglos Section I
The one`s with Shagya Blood are registered as Anglos Section II |
| Report to Moderator |
|
|
Lynda
Platinum Member
England
1957 Posts |
Posted - 16 Feb 2011 : 6:09:43 PM
|
The Shagya as a breed is not considered a pure arab - in G.B. they are given 90% at the moment, although in some countries they are given more.
Henry Wynmalen's Basa (Shagya XII-3) was a prime example. When first imported from Hungary, he was registered in G.B. as an Anglo, which some time later was changed and he was registered as a Part-bred Arab. |
| Report to Moderator |
|
|
Sabine K
Bronze Member
130 Posts |
Posted - 16 Feb 2011 : 6:12:35 PM
|
Shagya blood is allowed as well
Anglos out of Arab and TB crossings are Anglos Section I
The one`s with Shagya Blood are registered as Anglos Section II
Edit:
And in 3. Generation an Arabian Partbred (Typ German Sporthorse) is allowed as well |
| Report to Moderator |
|
|
Sabine K
Bronze Member
130 Posts |
Posted - 16 Feb 2011 : 6:16:19 PM
|
@ Lynda
Yes I know that - learned that in Australia.
As far as I know, Anglos with shagya Blood are only "Purebred Anglos" in Germany, Hungary and Poland.
But in the englisch speeking countries (Australia, England, USA) they will be registered as Partbreds.
That`s why they are separated in Section I and Section II here in Germany.
Section I are the one`s who are "globaly registable as anglos"
As far as I know, France does not Use Shagya Blood either.
|
| Report to Moderator |
|
|
Lynda
Platinum Member
England
1957 Posts |
Posted - 16 Feb 2011 : 6:19:44 PM
|
So do Germany follow the French in having four sections of Anglos?
Section 1a: Arab and Thorughbred blood only with 25% and over.
Section 1b: Arab and Thoroughbred blood only with under 25%
Section 11a: Arab cross thoroughbred, plus "other" blood allowed in the 4th or 5th generation carrying 25% and over
Section 11b: As section 11a but with less than 25%
|
Edited by - Lynda on 17 Feb 2011 09:56:50 AM |
| Report to Moderator |
|
|
Sabine K
Bronze Member
130 Posts |
Posted - 16 Feb 2011 : 6:24:40 PM
|
As far as I know, France extended on another section sice last year.
Called "The Anglo-Arab-Parbred" |
| Report to Moderator |
|
|
Sabine K
Bronze Member
130 Posts |
Posted - 16 Feb 2011 : 6:42:08 PM
|
@ Lynda
Sorry for my bad English. I can speak it fluenty - but I am not good in writing.
We have two Sections in our German Anglo Studbook.
Section one includes the anglos, who have consistantly TB, Purbreds and Anglos in the pedigree who themselfes are registered in section I in any registration studbook worldwide.
Each percentage should be at least 25 %
Section two allows in 4th generation a maximum of one horse that`s not TB, Purebred, Anglo, Shagya.
Still, 25 % at least of TB or Arab Blood is required.
(Ponys and coldbloodes Horses are now allowed) |
| Report to Moderator |
|
|
templars
Platinum Member
England
1852 Posts |
Posted - 16 Feb 2011 : 6:57:56 PM
|
Cracking achievement
He's related to the beautiful and talented Taragun!!!!!! Her maternal grandsire, Ghibli, is his paternal great-great grandsire. And he's got Crabbet lines, going back to Blue Domino!
He's definitely a section II because he has Oldenberg in his pedigree on the dam line, so in the UK he would be a part bred. The Oldenberg lines are Donnerhall and Pik Koenig.
|
   www.eviepeel.com    |
| Report to Moderator |
|
|
Jess.And.Tiger
Silver Member
England
344 Posts |
Posted - 16 Feb 2011 : 7:07:39 PM
|
Oh my lord he is STUNNING!!!
I think I'm in love... |
| Report to Moderator |
|
|
nn
Gold Member
England
659 Posts |
Posted - 16 Feb 2011 : 7:43:26 PM
|
Just found Bonaparte on the web. He is a beautifull grey AA. Fantastic jump and he has been graded Hanovarian and had a licence for trakehners in 2010
Why dont the British warmblood stud books except the AA and PBA stallions like the Germans do i wonder.
Nicky |
|
| Report to Moderator |
|
|
Sabine K
Bronze Member
130 Posts |
Posted - 16 Feb 2011 : 8:15:18 PM
|
@ NN
Do you have a stallion licening test in England ?
Warmblood Stallions have to pass this test.
And if Anglos or Partbreds want the permission for the warmblood breeds, they have to pass this test as well.
We just have a lovely purebred Stallion who coverd more than 30 Warmblood mares here in Germany.
It seems, that warmbloodpeople loose the fear against purebred arabs by using this stallion.
He even won the stallion performance test against all the warmbloods.
http://www.hengsthaltung-kathmann.de/cms/front_content.php?changelang=1&idcat=61
|
| Report to Moderator |
|
|
Sabine K
Bronze Member
130 Posts |
Posted - 16 Feb 2011 : 8:17:28 PM
|
Sorry, just to make sure that there is no missunderstaning.
This stallion passed its test last year (of course there are few purebreds more who are also allowed for warmblood breedings) |
| Report to Moderator |
|
|
Sabine K
Bronze Member
130 Posts |
Posted - 16 Feb 2011 : 8:19:08 PM
|
Edit:
He even won the stallion performance test against all the warmbloods - at his stallion perfomance testing station (not the only one in Germany)  |
| Report to Moderator |
|
|
Sabine K
Bronze Member
130 Posts |
|
|
nn
Gold Member
England
659 Posts |
Posted - 16 Feb 2011 : 9:24:58 PM
|
Hi Sabine
To grade into the trakehner stud book in this country the stallions have to be presented for grading at the TBF show. We have one a year.
We have a panel of judges. Two sent by the verband and then three more. Usually two british and one form another country. Last year it was France. This year i think Denmark.
They are assessed as in Germany. In Hand and then loose. They also loose jump. They have to pass a five stage vetting and have a full set of clean x rays. Plus clean CEM and EVA status.
If they are excepted in to the main stud book they have to performance test.If they go to Germany and pass they are licenced by the verband for world wide. If they do the NASTA which is the UK performance test then they are only licenced for this country.
The Nasta test is only run over two days. Ridden, in hand, show jumping, x country, loose jump and rider test and dressage.
I am a director for trakehners uk and we are trying to set up a 30 day performance test in this country. The verband will send there rider and testers. We have a venue willing to host it and two other breed societies happy to send stallions so fingers crossed it might happen late this year or next.
My 5 yr old stallion who has full pink papers but is registered PBA will grade this year. His half brother has just been exported back to Germany to stand at stud. So i am keen to have him graded but not happy to send him to Germany for his performance test as he is very precious.He carries a very important dam line and that is why his brother has gone back to Germany.
My other stallion who is graded premium with the AHS also has full pink papers and his dam is from the famous "K" line.My stallions great grand dam is the dam of kostalany.He missed grading as a trakehner due to an accident. But once i have him competing at advanced dressage he can be graded by the Germans if i so wish.
My anglo arab stallion who is dead (but i have frozen semen from) is the only AA stallion in this country to grade into the main trakehner stud book. He is also the only AA stallion to ever have life grading form the sports horse GB stud book.
I also have one of only two AA mares in this country graded into the main trakehner stud book.
Nicky |
|
| Report to Moderator |
|
|
BabsR
Platinum Member
England
2790 Posts |
Posted - 16 Feb 2011 : 10:57:49 PM
|
Sabine...many thanks for that information.....and AHS please take note
France last year added a new section to their stud books... would you believe "Part Bred Anglo Arab"
Is that not just what our Anglo Breeders have been trying to get across...(much simpler to understand than Anglo Arab Section 1 and Anglo Arab section 11)
Part Bred Arab and Part Bred Anglo Arab entered into one Stud Book
two parts
Pure Bred Arab and Pure Bred Anglo Arab then having their own individual closed Stud Books......makes more sense and does away with the present confusion with all the section rubbish and their sub divisions
Unfortunately as a dedicated Pure Anglo Breeder and much as I like Ismahn.....would not use him across my Mares as progeny would not be eligible for entry into AHS Anglo Arab Stud Book
Babs
SunrayAngloArabianStud.co.uk
|
|
| Report to Moderator |
|
|
weirton
Gold Member
873 Posts |
Posted - 17 Feb 2011 : 07:51:03 AM
|
Just hurriedly read this topic as I'm off out, but (and please correct me if I have misunderstood) as I read Sabine's description of Anglo definitions in Germany etc. there doesn't seem to be a pure Anglo section for our TB/Arab less than 25%. Does this disinherit those in our British Stud Book?
Jean |
       |
| Report to Moderator |
|
|
Topic |
|
Anglo Arab Stallion Grades in Germany
