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nissibay
Gold Member
 England
595 Posts |
 Posted - 19 Dec 2010 : 2:28:51 PM
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Hello me again.....
Im probly over thinking this as usual but anyhoo..
Verona is out in the day and in at night...
When i first got her she was out all the time and she was fine ears forward and never seen her ears back for a minute
but since being stabled because of the winter she is getting a wee bit grumpy at the stable door her ears are going back now, i find it a shame for one so young to pull faces and i wouldnt want her to be one of those moody horses...
obviously i understand she is probly frustrated when she is inside.. it does look like frustration rather than nastyness.. out of the stable she is as sweet as pie!!!
also i have been feeding her just as i leave so she its it alone do you think it would help if i am there when she is eating so she doesnt end up possesive, i know she will be the horse she is meant to be but i want her to be happy and friendly!!!thanks if anyone has any thought xx
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Sheen 
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garnet
Platinum Member
2382 Posts |
Posted - 19 Dec 2010 : 3:05:09 PM
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| Can you leave her out all the time? Garnet hated being in and for the last few years of her life flatly refused to be stabled. She lived out in frost and snow, suitably rugged, while she was clipped and in work and then when she was retired and furry. She was always tied up on the yard to be fed and hayed as putting her inside brought on roaring, weaving, peeing and pooing (record was 2 poos and a pee in approx. 4 mins) and I always feared she would bring on a colic if I insisted. I understand this may not be an option if no other horses are living out 24/7. |
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Fee
Platinum Member
2601 Posts |
Posted - 19 Dec 2010 : 3:23:02 PM
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Hi Sheen,
What's her stable set up like, busy, quiet, can see others etc? Is she in at night because it's winter? I would watch her in the stable and see if there's something annoying her. If poss try to do it without her seeing you to get a good idea. I did this with my previous horse and discovered that she hated the gelding next door putting his head into her space. I thought she'd like to be able to interact with a mate, but no, she wanted her own space. I got the partition raised and she was happy again.
Also, and I'm in no way suggesting this is happening to Verona but I had Po in a livery and she never grumbles about anything, so i thought it very strange one day when she refused to go into her stable. I knew there was something wrong and listened to her. I investigated and found out someone had done something to hurt her in her stable. Why anyone would want to hurt Po I'll never know, but there are a lot of horrible jealous people out there. Just be open minded and keep doing what you're doing, i.e listening to your girl. She is telling you something and if you listen and make it better she'll trust you and keep communicating with you, jmo and experience.
Fee |
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joanna_piana
Platinum Member
United Kingdom
3935 Posts |
Posted - 19 Dec 2010 : 3:40:09 PM
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| I think it's a mare thing. Ishara can be a little grumpy over the stable door but is her usual sweet self once you start doing anything with her. I think the winter generally makes them a bit grumpier especially at the moment as turnout is more restricted and not much to eat when they are out so all a bit dull for them. |
      
Harthall Rashida RIP, Binley Ishara, Bouchan
Chorleywood, Hertfordshire |
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LYNDILOU
Platinum Member
United Kingdom
13976 Posts |
Posted - 19 Dec 2010 : 4:33:54 PM
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This is not normal for charismma stock , they are usually loving and kind not at all grumpy, unless maybe she has been upset (they are also very sensitive by nature) Is it you that puts her out mornings and brings her in evenings? if not maybe she has had some insensitive handling.
Remember she was a blank canvas when you got her at just 5 month old and all she learns from now on will be what you or someone else handling her will teach her.
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LYNDILOU
Platinum Member
United Kingdom
13976 Posts |
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carolinek
New Member
England
13 Posts |
Posted - 19 Dec 2010 : 5:01:03 PM
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Verona has always been the sweetest filly. Are you feeding her enough? We always top up hay at 10 or 11pm. If you cant do that make sure she she has plenty to last the night, if there is a little left in the morning you will know you are giving her emough. younsters need so much food, |
Edited by - carolinek on 19 Dec 2010 5:07:03 PM |
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nissibay
Gold Member
England
595 Posts |
Posted - 19 Dec 2010 : 5:23:42 PM
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| Hello, thanx for all your comments....I let her out in the morning and bring her in at night, but another lady feeds her in the morning, before i get there. she was the first to notice this her with her ears back, i assume she is being kind to her she is a lovely lady...... she has nothing but kind handling from me. as i said she is LOVELY AND HAPPY the second i lead her out of the stable.... she does normally have hay left in the morning... so it cant be that. my only other thoughts are that the horse in the next stable is grumpy. perhaps copying???? so if she has enough food and is handled kindly not sure what else it could be. dont get me wrong she is wonderfully lovley and calm and kind. it always sounds more dramatic when its wrtten on here... she lets me do anything with her. i just didnt like seeing her uncontent for a minute as she was so content when i got her and as someone said she learns through me |
Sheen
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nissibay
Gold Member
England
595 Posts |
Posted - 19 Dec 2010 : 5:39:48 PM
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PS if you remember when i first got her we had unforseen problems at the stables i had chosen. she had to stay in for 2 weeks, she was as good as gold but towards the end of the 2 weeks i could see it was just starting to pee her off.... i do feel that didnt help her at all and im annoyed that the lady did that to her "wouldnt let her go in the field" so perhaps she thinks she every time that she is going to be kept in.... its annoying as i wanted everything to perfect for her and have the best experiences.... |
Sheen
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loosefur
Gold Member
584 Posts |
Posted - 19 Dec 2010 : 5:53:45 PM
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| Youngsters should be out 24/7 IMO - can you leave her out? It's so much better for them mentally and physically. I can think of no reason any youngstock should be stabled unless the rules of your yard don't allow 24/7 turnout. If that's the case then I'd find another yard! |
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Honeyb060674
Platinum Member
United Kingdom
4301 Posts |
Posted - 19 Dec 2010 : 5:55:31 PM
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Oh bless her they are such sensitive souls. Is it ears back while she's being fed? That is the one & only time Sunny ever has his ears back, and its not through grumpiness/unhappiness he's just rather eager to be fed!
Fee has a good point about Verona's neighbours, Honey used to get so upset when her space was invaded. Neighbouring horse used to reach round to look in her stable & she'd go mental!
I've always found mares to be alot more sensitive in general. Maybe she is just a little fed up? I try to spend time just pootling about the stable, brushing & scratching. I often sit in the corner of his stable and have a chat, he's a very sociable boy  Some horses just like the company! |
      
Claire & Sunny x
http://sunnyandclaire.blogspot.com/ |
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templars
Platinum Member
England
1852 Posts |
Posted - 19 Dec 2010 : 5:56:51 PM
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I'd guess she's copying the horse next door.
We have a mare that pulls the most horrible faces - she's not at all nasty but she just looks grumpy. She's never been nasty she just frowns a lot. She's also the alpha mare in the herd. When she had her first foal, the foal was happy, inquisitive and a total soft pot. She also grew up knowing mum was top of the pecking order and she just assumed she was too.
The foal continued to be loving and affectionate right though weaning and after. Then a couple of years ago, the foal (now a 4 year old) spent the summer and winter with mum - and guess what - the youngster started pulling faces too! We would watch her studying her mother and then she would try out the faces, sometimes she'd frown but leave her ears forward and sometimes she'd put her ears back but smile - it took her a while to get all the movements co-ordinated. Her temperament has never changed, she's still as friendly and loving as always and sometimes she gets it totally wrong and pulls the face at the wrong time or starts to pull a face and forgets why she started.
When she's away from mum, she forgets to pull the faces all together so it hasn't changed her too much
So long as your filly is happy and well and isn't showing any behavioural changes to accompany the faces, I wouldn't be too worried.
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TAE
Bronze Member
232 Posts |
Posted - 19 Dec 2010 : 9:19:55 PM
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From whats been said it could well be the horse next door.
Imagine going to work and spending all day next to the office misery guts, whine, whine , moan, moan, Get out of my face.
Even the sweetest person ever would end up feeling down.
Is there any way you could move stables away from this horse and just see if it helps.
Must admit though, I also like to keep mine out 24/7 with a shelter and ad lib hay. |
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Zenitha
Gold Member
England
1078 Posts |
Posted - 19 Dec 2010 : 10:11:03 PM
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Have to echo some of what Honey said - is it just at feeding time ? Many horses get a bit tetchy when they know their bucket is coming, ears back, but no actual intention to nip !
I have a weanling colt, roughly the same age as Verona, also stabled at night. He is the sweetest, kindest boy you could ever imagine, he wouldn't dream of doing anything naughty, but as soon as he see's his bucket, his ears go back and he looks a right grump !
Verona's half brother Ali also has a super temperament - but during the show season when he spent a lot of time stabled (not my choice)he did become a bit nippy. Not maliciously, purely out of sheer boredom. I was so happy to get him home and let him lead a more normal life again,he has never nipped since !
I guess unless Verona actually starts nipping (and I'm sure she's well fed and cared for !)you may have to put up with a bit of face pulling at feed time - it might just be because she feels a little insecure with other horses around, and her being just a wee baby she is trying to look scary to anyone who will notice - she's certainly not alone in her face pulling antics  |
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nissibay
Gold Member
England
595 Posts |
Posted - 19 Dec 2010 : 10:25:24 PM
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| thanx Jane u have reasured me :) she is happy being out i will speak to YO. as they are having to in at 3.30pm as it gets dark and she is an 18 acre field and i cant find her in the dark lol.. its a long old evening and night for a baby isnt it.... |
Sheen
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jaj
Platinum Member
United Kingdom
4324 Posts |
Posted - 19 Dec 2010 : 10:30:04 PM
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Sheena my baby is in at night, he loves his little house bless him but that's a different topic altogether  !
Mine both flatten their ears when tea is delivered but it means absolutely nothing. I think they just get a bit excited and impatient, it doesn't mean they are miserable. I often put the feed down and then just sit next to them whilst they eat watching and talking to them, their ears are fine and forward then  . |
     
Kuraishiya (Maleik el Kheil/Kazra el Saghira) and Sahara Bey (Kuraishiya/WSA Charismma) |
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nissibay
Gold Member
England
595 Posts |
Posted - 19 Dec 2010 : 10:35:54 PM
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| Ohhh Jaj thankyou it is good to here that, as ive heard how brilliant temperment crimbo are so i was like ooooh what have i done wrong, paranoid mother sydrome!!!!!!! |
Sheen
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loosefur
Gold Member
584 Posts |
Posted - 19 Dec 2010 : 11:32:24 PM
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| I do worry about all these horses spending so much time inside, especially youngsters who need movement in order to mature properly. If horse are being turned out at daylight, 7.30am at the moment and brought in at 3.30pm that means only 8 hours out and a wacking great 16 hours stuck in a stable with restricted movement. Not only will their tendons and ligaments not develop as much strength their bone development will also be affected as well as the quality of their feet. Mentally it also causes huge issues - kept alone they don't learn herd behaviour and therefore can be more difficult to handle and train in the future. Mentally it is also very tough as their natural instincts are denied to them. All youngsters should be out as much as possible - keeping them in for 75% of the time is just not right IMO. If you can't turn a youngster out for the vast majority of the time then you shouldn't have one. Sorry for sounding harsh but its something I feel strongly about having seen the affects of restricted turnout on youngstock. |
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jaj
Platinum Member
United Kingdom
4324 Posts |
Posted - 20 Dec 2010 : 08:48:58 AM
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I totally agree that youngsters should be out as much as possible and for the best part of the year mine is out 24/7, but it went down to minus 19 last night where I am and the ground is absolutely rock hard  . Yes he is 'only' out for 8 hours a day but they have access to their stables during the day and believe me when I get down by 4pm they are more often than not already inside their stables munching hay and looking forward to their tea .
Sheena our Crimbo babies sound very similar . |
Kuraishiya (Maleik el Kheil/Kazra el Saghira) and Sahara Bey (Kuraishiya/WSA Charismma) |
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LYNDILOU
Platinum Member
United Kingdom
13976 Posts |
Posted - 20 Dec 2010 : 09:24:37 AM
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| Loosefur, I have been getting my horses in at dark where I know they are safe and warm, young and old for the past 25 years, I have never experienced any growth problems with them, just the opposite they have gone on to be well adjusted mentally, ridden horses that compete in endurance, showing , ridden work and live well into their old ages . the majority of responsible owners do this. are you then saying we should not have horses? |
www.dreamfield-arabians.com |
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loosefur
Gold Member
584 Posts |
Posted - 20 Dec 2010 : 10:31:30 AM
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| Why are horses safer and warmer inside? Outside they can move about, huddle together, eat at all times - all things that keep them warm. Inside they are stuck in a small space where movement is limited, they are on their own so cannot share body heat with other horses and once they've finished their nets (which most will have done well before they get turned back out in the morning) they have nothing to eat. Horses are definitely warmer when kept outside in conditions like we have at the moment. I really don't understand, when people have a choice, why they bring horses in at night. Lyndilou - I assume you at least have yours out at night in the summer? |
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jaj
Platinum Member
United Kingdom
4324 Posts |
Posted - 20 Dec 2010 : 10:39:48 AM
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Mine have tons of ad-lib hay. There is ALWAYS hay available for them night and day. They don't have nets, it's on the floor as healthier for them that way  .
I defy anyone to say that it would be warmer out on a hill in sub sub zero temperatures with a biting artic wind blowing than tucked up in the warm with rugs, thick beds and rubber matting to lie on. It just doesn't add up  .
What would they be eating outside anyway if the ground is totally frozen  ? Hay? Well they have that indoors plus their straw beds which they love to nibble. |
Kuraishiya (Maleik el Kheil/Kazra el Saghira) and Sahara Bey (Kuraishiya/WSA Charismma) |
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jaj
Platinum Member
United Kingdom
4324 Posts |
Posted - 20 Dec 2010 : 10:41:29 AM
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| I was at a livery yard once where they all lived out and one thing I noticed is that they didn't move about at all. They just stood still (not huddled together either) and zoned out to try and conserve heat and energy I presume. |
Kuraishiya (Maleik el Kheil/Kazra el Saghira) and Sahara Bey (Kuraishiya/WSA Charismma) |
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loosefur
Gold Member
584 Posts |
Posted - 20 Dec 2010 : 10:49:01 AM
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I'm assuming you don't need to shut your stable doors jaj? What would happen if you left the door wide open?
Living on site with my lot I'm lucky enough to be able to observe them a lot and they move round the field a huge amount - very rarely do they stay in one place for very long, usually only when it's a warm sunny morning and they are having a group doze. One of my mares has actually put weight on in this weather. She is out 24/7 in a very lightweight rug and is getting no extra feed, just the grass in her field. I can go out at whatever time of night and put a hand under my lots rugs and find them toasty warm - they are all far happier to be out. I don't think they'd talk to me again if I tried keeping them inside at night! |
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jaj
Platinum Member
United Kingdom
4324 Posts |
Posted - 20 Dec 2010 : 10:58:02 AM
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er what grass??
Stable doors are open all day so they can go in and out as they please, they tend to use the field most of the day and then around 2.30 -3.30pm they take themselves inside.
Yes I close the doors at night .
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Kuraishiya (Maleik el Kheil/Kazra el Saghira) and Sahara Bey (Kuraishiya/WSA Charismma) |
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pinkvboots
Platinum Member
United Kingdom
3290 Posts |
Posted - 20 Dec 2010 : 11:01:15 AM
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| I don't think it will harm any youngster or older horse to spend time in a stable at night, if we could all keep our horses at home and suit ourselves it would be great but in the real world some of us don't have that luxury and have to keep them on livery and most livery yards have restricted turnout. Loosefur you are one of the lucky ones so good for you, but just because our horses are not out 24 -7 does not mean they are suffering in any way. |
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Any thoughts or advice please?x
