| Author |
 Topic  |
|
|
honey
Platinum Member
 N. Ireland
2634 Posts |
 Posted - 07 Jun 2009 : 9:02:31 PM
|
ok heres a pic of a 50% arab filly, her dam was a black and white cob and her sire was my chestnut stallion rocians. what colour should be on her passport, apperantly not grey as no grey parents, some have suggested liver chestnut, some silver black and i think possibly blue roan lol. in the first picture you can see a strong dapple under her winter coat so suggesting heavy to me silver black. shes got a small cosmetic hernia thats under veterinary supervision(told to leave it at the moment not causeing any harm as umbilica hole has now closed over)
|
    
|
Edited by - honey on 08 Jun 2009 4:13:27 PM
|
|
Report to moderator
|
|
|
rosie
Platinum Member
England
3662 Posts |
Posted - 07 Jun 2009 : 10:07:12 PM
|
I would say possibly liver chestnut at the moment  , but definitely looks like she'll end up as grey.
see what other ALiners suggest.But grey for me.
Lisa |
     
Last picture courtesy of Sweet Photography |
Report to Moderator  |
|
|
jane79
Platinum Member
England
1618 Posts |
Posted - 07 Jun 2009 : 10:24:29 PM
|
on my geldings passport he was born chestnut (which is what has been put on passport) but he is grey now. So im not sure if the colour just goes on the passport of what he is at the moment.if that makes sense?
|
     |
| Report to Moderator |
|
|
faymouse
Silver Member
United Kingdom
412 Posts |
Posted - 07 Jun 2009 : 10:31:54 PM
|
Certainly agree she will be grey but not sure what you would say now. Old army blanket grey? Thats for those that remember them
PS She is very lovely |
Edited by - faymouse on 07 Jun 2009 10:33:05 PM |
| Report to Moderator |
|
|
honey
Platinum Member
N. Ireland
2634 Posts |
Posted - 07 Jun 2009 : 10:45:00 PM
|
| ahh thanks, soo many people have told me she can't be grey as she hasn't got a grey parent and need on grey parent to get a grey foal. I thought she looked a shade of grey too. |
|
| Report to Moderator |
|
|
Marie-Molly
Gold Member
United Kingdom
929 Posts |
Posted - 07 Jun 2009 : 10:51:44 PM
|
Definitively can't be grey if the sire is chestnut and the dam is a black tobiano! You HAVE to have a grey parent to get a grey offspring! Have you had a look at the grand-parents for any roaning?
Marie |
    |
| Report to Moderator |
|
|
Kharidian
Platinum Member
England
4297 Posts |
Posted - 07 Jun 2009 : 11:11:19 PM
|
I really don't know - but she CANNOT be grey; I only know basic colour genetics but you can't have a grey without a grey parent!
In the earlier pictures she looks as though she may be liver - but there definitely appears to be some roaning on the face.
Hhmmm, interesting!
Caryn |
Kharidian (Prince Sadik x Khiri)........ Alkara Cassino (H Tobago x Rose Aboud)
aka "Roger".................................... aka "Chips"
     
The first image is from an original painting by Pat Shorto.
South-East Essex |
| Report to Moderator |
|
|
honey
Platinum Member
N. Ireland
2634 Posts |
Posted - 07 Jun 2009 : 11:13:48 PM
|
| not sure about the grand parents on the dam side but ros his sire and dam where both chestnut and his sires sire and dam were both bay. |
|
| Report to Moderator |
|
|
honey
Platinum Member
N. Ireland
2634 Posts |
Posted - 07 Jun 2009 : 11:24:34 PM
|
under her arm pits are really light looked grey to me very misty,
heres a pic of her dam and her the day she was born
 |
|
| Report to Moderator |
|
|
mouse
Silver Member
United Kingdom
309 Posts |
Posted - 08 Jun 2009 : 08:03:46 AM
|
She definitely can't be grey if she doesn't have a grey parent. Is there any chance the sire is not who you think it is? 
Mouse
|
    
South Norfolk/Suffolk border |
| Report to Moderator |
|
|
honey
Platinum Member
N. Ireland
2634 Posts |
|
|
amalpass
Junior Member
43 Posts |
Posted - 08 Jun 2009 : 4:25:27 PM
|
I think she has invented a new colour!!!
Once was told the colour all round the eyes would be the true colour.
She looks dark brown to me with an odd coloured tail for that colouring!!
Just face it she is unique, a one off!! and beautiful with it. |
| Report to Moderator |
|
|
Montikka
Platinum Member
United Kingdom
2653 Posts |
Posted - 08 Jun 2009 : 4:48:26 PM
|
No doubting she is beautiful, I'd have said grey, but I know little about genetics, she seems as though she has the piebald colouring; due to her dark face and yet grey tail(as if the skin underneath is patchy) Some areas appear roan but others more solid - but not in a conventional way - Not sure what they'd put on her passport, as they state how the animal appears before them on the day; rather than how they'll be in years to come. Erm............??? Grey |
   
Louise, Warwickshire |
| Report to Moderator |
|
|
faymouse
Silver Member
United Kingdom
412 Posts |
Posted - 08 Jun 2009 : 5:14:53 PM
|
| I thought that genetically chesnut is the closest to grey and two chesnuts or even one can, in the gene pool create a grey? What I have always heard. If you look on allpedigree.com maybe you will see grey produced by chesnut parents or greys producing chestnut offspring? |
| Report to Moderator |
|
|
honey
Platinum Member
N. Ireland
2634 Posts |
Posted - 08 Jun 2009 : 5:32:24 PM
|
| i know grey can produce chestnut off spring but chestnut can't produce grey off spring, as you def need a grey parent before grey can happen as its not as much a coat colour but a pattern of the coat, from what ive read. But no expert, someone said she has to be a liver chestnut with a sabino tail, as she can't have the silver dilution from ros cause hes arab. |
|
| Report to Moderator |
|
|
honey
Platinum Member
N. Ireland
2634 Posts |
Posted - 08 Jun 2009 : 5:33:51 PM
|
| but she doesn;t look very chestnut in colour to me more black/blue. |
|
| Report to Moderator |
|
|
Kharidian
Platinum Member
England
4297 Posts |
Posted - 08 Jun 2009 : 6:38:59 PM
|
Faymouse said:
I thought that genetically chesnut is the closest to grey and two chesnuts or even one can, in the gene pool create a grey?
BUT.....Chestnut to chestnut can only ever produce chestnut; no exceptions!
However I agree that a chestnut can arrive without a chestnut parent (Kharidian is chestnut, sire = grey, dam = bay).
I have to say, I was thinking what Mouse asked - no chance a cheeky colt got at the mare?
Caryn |
Kharidian (Prince Sadik x Khiri)........ Alkara Cassino (H Tobago x Rose Aboud)
aka "Roger".................................... aka "Chips"
The first image is from an original painting by Pat Shorto.
South-East Essex |
| Report to Moderator |
|
|
MinHe
Platinum Member
England
2927 Posts |
Posted - 08 Jun 2009 : 7:14:44 PM
|
IMO, she will end up black. Black goes through some funny colours at foal/yearling/even 2yo before settling down.
Keren |
| Report to Moderator |
|
|
honey
Platinum Member
N. Ireland
2634 Posts |
Posted - 08 Jun 2009 : 11:27:14 PM
|
| nope kharidian the person has all his colts gelding as soon as they have dropped and he had the last colt gelded the year before the foal was concieved and the mare was with us to be put in foal and we have no other colts or even geldings all mares so ros is 100% certainly the dad lol. |
|
| Report to Moderator |
|
|
BOULTONS
Silver Member
United Kingdom
380 Posts |
Posted - 09 Jun 2009 : 07:25:43 AM
|
| I have known bays to have grey in their tails which grows out (Drongo did until he was late four) so presume chestnuts can to. |
| Report to Moderator |
|
|
Reagarth
Bronze Member
England
92 Posts |
Posted - 09 Jun 2009 : 8:00:08 PM
|
I had a lovely Crabbet stallion, St Dominick (Blue Domino son) back in the early 80's who was liver chestnut with a sprinkling of silver in his tail - my money's on liver chestnut |
Reagarth Arabians |
| Report to Moderator |
|
|
Peterina
New Member
Belgium
16 Posts |
Posted - 09 Jun 2009 : 11:07:04 PM
|
She's black based ... chestnut foals are not born with black in mane or tail, and on the head shot you can definitely see black mane.
If the sire carries agouti (being a chestnut he will not show it), then she could have inferited it and will become a very dark (seal?) brown.
If no agouti from the sire then she looks as if she will be black.
The white in tail could be caused by the sabino gene (I don't know the sire so can't tell you if it comes from him, dam could be a carrier) even though she is minimally marked. |
Palomino's are dancing sunbeams. |
| Report to Moderator |
|
|
vanishtrik
Bronze Member
England
136 Posts |
Posted - 10 Jun 2009 : 2:21:16 PM
|
| i think the Brown colour is just the remains of the winter coat, i think she could go blue roan or a smokey black, and the old saying a good horse is never a bad colour, shes certainly eye catching |
 |
| Report to Moderator |
|
|
Nichole Waller
Gold Member
England
1168 Posts |
Posted - 10 Jun 2009 : 3:09:32 PM
|
OMG this has really got me thinking... She looks like a smokey grey black to me in the pictures, but i know nothing about colouring and genetics etc...
I've read with interest the response above and am now really confused about the colour of my boy below..
His passport says Grey. His sire was Black (Omar el Sireff) and his dam (i've been told) was a very dark bay (almost black) (Saarida Bint Shahliah). There are grey grandparents on his dams side.
His coat close up looks very dark grey (like pewter) with white hairs running through it, although he does have some fine brown hairs in his coat and in his main and tail which made me think he may end up fleabitten grey. Sometime in different lights he almost looks like a rose grey (if there is such a colour)
What do people think? Is he grey? Will he stay this colour? If not, what colour do people think he will end up?
 |
       |
| Report to Moderator |
|
|
Grey Girl
Platinum Member
England
1554 Posts |
Posted - 10 Jun 2009 : 4:34:20 PM
|
Whilst I don't know the details of the sub-types of chestnut gene there are two basic elements here.
Sire is chestnut which means he has two ch genes for colour (as chestnut is recessive). So filly has inherited one ch gene from him.
Dam is piebald. Piebald is dominant, so her colour genes are PB and unknown. Filly has inherited the unknown gene from her - she's not piebald so she hasn't inherited that gene. And mum's recessive gene is not chestnut, otherwise filly would be chestnut (as you need to carry two ch genes to be chestnut).
So look back to the colour of the dam's parents and grandparents and you might be able to work out what the recessive gene is and thereby figure out what baby has inherited and therefore what she is likely to end up. Unless of course she has a mutated gene which has done something interesting to her colour.
However, you have one cute looking filly there so I hope she doesn't end up an ordinary bay!!! |
 Said the little eohippus, "I´m going to be a HORSE"  |
| Report to Moderator |
|
|
Kharidian
Platinum Member
England
4297 Posts |
Posted - 10 Jun 2009 : 5:14:20 PM
|
Nichole,
Your boy is grey; being so dark he will probably "grey out" quite late and I don't think it's possible to tell, as yet, whether or not he will be flea-bitten.
Good luck at your show in 2 weeks, did you get a chance to go to HOCON?
Caryn |
Kharidian (Prince Sadik x Khiri)........ Alkara Cassino (H Tobago x Rose Aboud)
aka "Roger".................................... aka "Chips"
The first image is from an original painting by Pat Shorto.
South-East Essex |
| Report to Moderator |
|
|
Topic |
|
what colour would you say updated pics
