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Honeyb060674
Platinum Member
United Kingdom
4301 Posts |
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nikki
Platinum Member
Wales
4384 Posts |
 Posted - 24 Oct 2006 : 12:31:16 PM
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Like magic, aint it!
How do you do it? |
pagey |
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Honeyb060674
Platinum Member
United Kingdom
4301 Posts |
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joanna_piana
Platinum Member
United Kingdom
3935 Posts |
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Qui Gon Jinn
Platinum Member
Scotland
1627 Posts |
Posted - 24 Oct 2006 : 7:28:05 PM
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Egbert, I am truely grateful for all your comments on my colt, Meriden MH. As you say he is a grey (steel grey at the moment) and does have very nice conformation. He floats along as if his feet aren't really touching the ground and is without doubt one of the most loving arabs I've owned. He has a very nice body shape and is fairly tall for his 18 months (standing 14hh). I am hoping to keep him entire..............my only reservation with this was the thought of whither or not he would be good enough to breed from, and also if he would have many prospective wifes?! Your comments have encouraged me to keep him entire and I am actually looking forward to the hard work of trailing him up and down the countryside to get him seen and known!!
This was Merlyn (Meriden MH) in August. I bought him at the end of June this year. He is still a little on the poor side as he had had restricted access to grazing and had been kept prodominently in his stable. This was no reflection on the previous owner, but sadly more down to the fact that the livery yard didn't have enough grazing for colts! As you can also see he is growning out his bridle path!!
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The Soul would have no Rainbow....If the Eyes had shed no Tears. |
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Fee
Platinum Member
2601 Posts |
Posted - 24 Oct 2006 : 8:16:46 PM
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Jayne I'm so delighted with what Egbert said about Merlyn, in particular what she said about keeping him entire. I deliberately didn't mention it (sorry to be sneaky Egbert ) but I knew you were unsure and I hoped it maybe help you with a decision. Let's face it, it's a huge decision to make and not to be taken lightly when you have such a wonderful boy!
Future wife? Eh...how about this girl..
I know, lots of Polish there, ages to mature, but what the heck they sure are worth it when they do  |
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Qui Gon Jinn
Platinum Member
Scotland
1627 Posts |
Posted - 24 Oct 2006 : 9:08:15 PM
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Hi Fee,
Thanks for giving Egbert Merlyn's details. I was really quite shocked by what was said! I really liked him from the word go, but didn't really know enough about his bloodlines to make such an assumption. Just shows how little I do know. This purchase was definitely more luck than good judgement!
As you say I've been really diliberating as to what to do about gelding him or not, as sadly when the've been removed that is it!! I'm sure that Po would be a very suitable wife for Merlyn, I'm sure he would be delighted with her! She is very pretty, with lovely movement and I think that it would be a nice mix................just a bit unfortunate that the Polish horses take so long to grow up. Quinn is now rising 7 and is only now starting to look a bit more of an adult..............pity that he still doesn't behave like one!
Once Po has returned to work and feeling better, you'll need to bring her down for a weekend. Be nice to have someone to ride with and be good for Merlyn to meet a different horse and in particular a stunning woman!
Jayne |
The Soul would have no Rainbow....If the Eyes had shed no Tears. |
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Qui Gon Jinn
Platinum Member
Scotland
1627 Posts |
Posted - 24 Oct 2006 : 9:57:06 PM
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Egbert, can I ask you to have a look at my gelding's lines? He is 75% arab and a mix of Crabbet and Polish blood. He is registered as Qui Gon Jinn by Eldor x Blue Sharwind. Unfortunately the dam line of Blue Sharwind stops abruptly with her mother Blue Easter, to my knowledge she was an anglo arab. I'd like to know your feelings on Quinn and if his bloodlines give any idication as to what he would be best suited to! He does like an audience and did very well with me this year in his first and only showing outing. I'd like him to have an all round education though but have hit various brick walls with him as he can be quite difficult at times and does like his own way!!
http://www.allbreedpedigree.com/qui+gon+jinn
Thanks so much for all your help and hard work.
Jayne |
The Soul would have no Rainbow....If the Eyes had shed no Tears. |
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Egbert
Gold Member
USA
1051 Posts |
Posted - 26 Oct 2006 : 11:52:11 AM
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Honey B...Could have sworn we did this pedigree at one time or another...Safraan-is a Mesaoud sire line mare and double Rodania dam line mare....Kuhailan Ajuz of the Ibn Rodan technically. It is an interesting pedigree in that this mare is the first that I've ever seen the Skowronek stallion REVENGE on the dam line! AND he is out of the Rodania line mare, Riyala who for some reason always seems to promise a rare elegance when found down on the dam line. Then the sire's dam line has Naziri via Shamnar for great beauty...and finally a very heavy dose of Azrek throughout but particularly strongly on the dam's side of the pedigree...So you have to have a surprisingly elegant but slightly masculine looking mare, possibly very pretty dry head, and g a very powerful moving mare. I've a hunch this mare demands that you earn her trust...but once she trusts you...she can be very endearing. (no witchcraft...see below...)
Nikki...Honest no magic...Just years and years and years of study, travel and living with these critters...
Joanna! Wow! Interesting mare! Hate the name as I can't say it without stuttering...Vlacq Itarille. She is Rabdan sire line; dam line to the Ali Pasha Sherif, Helwa...therefore a Seglawi Jedran...so she is capable of making some very beautiful, elegant babies, but would suspect she is a bit long and rather rounded behind...perhaps slightly apple rumped; she is probably sweet but have a hunch she is a bit pillar to post because it has been difficult deciding how to breed her successfully...Thus, she is a bit - cautious and tentative with people...("where am I going next? Will this person care?")She is a mare in need of more scope and so would be inclined to find a stallion with such and for that would go to a great Russian...Or a stallion like Adawy, FS Bengali, Narim, too. I like her and think she could be a lot of fun to breed from, ride, whatever.
Qui Jon Jinn/Jayne...Thank you for sharing the pictures...He will take a while to mature but think the results will make it a worthwhile wait as long as he remains sweet and my hunch is that he will.
Fee, think that girl could do well with him.
Jayne...Think Qui Gon Jinn would be a very lovely elegant but not earthshatteringly beautiful horse...slightly plain in the heard compared to most Arabians but beautiful next to other anglos...Soft and kind of disposition. Have a hunch this horse would look quite at home as part of the Queen's cavalry..if she has some white horse troops. A strong, reliable ride...Can he jump? He should be able to do just about anything athletic well but he doesn't have a lot of elasticity...In other words he could fox hunt decently but would be more fun on long trail rides...You know if you have a really outstanding dressage instructor around who would work with you and take it really slow and steady...think this horse could do very well if he can learn to work off of his hocks. Also, have a hunch he hasn't quite finished maturing physically tho' suspect he is there mentally...This is the kind of horse that will grow on a person..there appears to be a solid reliability factor in the pedigree. |
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Honeyb060674
Platinum Member
United Kingdom
4301 Posts |
Posted - 26 Oct 2006 : 1:48:00 PM
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Thanks Egbert Yes you did look at this a while back, and gave me a terrific summery of her pedigree for me. It was more your opinion of her characterics/personality I was interested in, as you seem to have an amazing skill for this You are abolutely right with her physical appearance, I have one picture that people have sworn she was a stallion and not a mare You are also spot on with the trust thing, but after 15 years we have it sorted |
      
Claire & Sunny x
http://sunnyandclaire.blogspot.com/ |
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joanna_piana
Platinum Member
United Kingdom
3935 Posts |
Posted - 26 Oct 2006 : 2:18:37 PM
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| Hi Egbert I'd say you were pretty spot on with Tara (far easier to say than her real name!) She is quite aloof but i've clicked with her instantly and she really is a great fun ride. She actually belongs to Evie who also posts on here so she might have more to say as I've only had her since July. I believe she has had a part bred foal and one foal that sadly died, not sure who the sire was. She has been great at converting the non arab contingency at my yard as she is such a sweety and very consistent to ride. I even allow the ten year old who loans my pony to ride her with no qualms whereas Shida would be inclined to deposit a child on the floor just for fun! |
      
Harthall Rashida RIP, Binley Ishara, Bouchan
Chorleywood, Hertfordshire |
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baymops
Gold Member
United Kingdom
1108 Posts |
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Qui Gon Jinn
Platinum Member
Scotland
1627 Posts |
Posted - 26 Oct 2006 : 4:40:35 PM
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Wow Egbert, I really don't know how you come up with your information!! You are of course spot on with your feelings on Quinn. I think mentally he has finally grown up, but his body shape and width this year has changed so much that I am still reeling from the shock of yet more saddles! When I bought him 2 years ago he was wearing a medium fit saddle...........now I've just had to purchase an extra wide fit!! My husband is of course delighted at all the money we've spent!! Quinn has a lovely disposition and is very much my horse. He adores me and we have a very special bond. I do need to find an instructor (think I've found the ideal one!) to help us and as you say take things slow with him.
A thousand thanks for all your hard work and response to my questions.
kind regards
Jayne
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The Soul would have no Rainbow....If the Eyes had shed no Tears. |
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Moosie
Gold Member
United Kingdom
717 Posts |
Posted - 26 Oct 2006 : 5:42:26 PM
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Egbert, been reading this thread on and off and have finally succumbed to temptation! If you can spare the time would you like to see what you can make of my bargain basement Ascot sales purchase (who Im absolutely delighted with by the way!). Totally understand if its an imposition as in no way is this a showing type horse and I doubt if I will ever breed from her. http//www.allbreedspedigree.com/pacific way
reckon its a bit different! |
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Fee
Platinum Member
2601 Posts |
Posted - 26 Oct 2006 : 9:54:13 PM
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Hi again Egbert,
This is only if you're really bored...
You very kindly looked at Po's pedigree for me and said...
She is a very interestingly bred mare...Russian/Polish; sire line Kuhailan Ajuz imported from the desert for the Balbona stud and bred by the Anazah. In the 5 th generation over half the lines trace to Crabbet Park or Sheykh Obeyd which translated means that she wouldn't look as she does but for Crabbet's creators! And of course she traces to the illustrious Milordka who, in the US, Poland and if I recall correctly, is the most winning of the Seglawi dam lines-or in a dead heat with the Crabbet APS import Bint Helwa. She must be an excellent breeding mare with that pedigree as well as a superb riding mare...With conditioning would imagine you would have fun showing her both in performance as well as halter. To my eye she screams quality and would be simply an outstanding broodmare with one proviso: Breed her to stallions whose foals mature early...an El Shaklan/Padron/Al Lahab type as normally this line doesn't hit it's greatest beauty until 7 years old or older. She must be a delight!
Which, don't get me wrong is wonderful! But like Honey I am curious if can you give me more on her character/personality traits??
But, honestly only if you have the time and/or inclination. You have done so much already I do feel to ask...
http://www.allbreedpedigree.com/polianka |
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Fee
Platinum Member
2601 Posts |
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Marie-Molly
Gold Member
United Kingdom
929 Posts |
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Egbert
Gold Member
USA
1051 Posts |
Posted - 27 Oct 2006 : 05:16:28 AM
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Honest, it's not witchcraft or magic. Years ago, back in the late 70's, I became utterly fascinated with Arabians after nearly 30 plus years of other lines and acquired an Arabian. To pay for the guy, had to find work and took a job where I was extremely well-paid but working a graveyard shift. To the shift, I brought every book on Arabian Horses available and think it is possible I've one of the most complete libraries on the West Coast....In any event, I read, studied, travelled on days off to see those horses represented in those lines and then after 4 years or so began writing for magazines. In the early '80's I came over to the UK for one of the magazines but actually on a quest in re Skowronek. By then it was apparent-but for the UK and for the most part the Blunts/Lady W/ Cecil and Grace Covey, Arabians as we know them wouldn't exist. Travel has enabled me to visit some of the world's leading breeders-as a writer and from there it has been comparatively easy to learn one important fact: These pedigrees are not an accident, it isn't a crap shoot to breed great horses...it is homework. Sure there are breeders that are genuinely gifted...I think the ability to breed great horses/dogs/cats/hamsters...can be in part genetic. There is little doubt that Lady Wentworth was the grand sum total of her parents ability to breed great horseflesh.
Lecture over!
Honey B, Safraan is an honest mare...or will be absolutely so with those she loves. That isn't to say she couldn't be full of mischief...With a son...would bet that he would be a rare character, full of fun, mischief and could become downright dangerous in the near future. There is a lot of intelligence there, to say the least!
Joanna, Would hope you do try to breed her to a good Seglawi stallion as I think you would have a rare individual...pure in the strain who could breed on beautifully! Sounds like a love match with you, too!
Baymops,
You have a very beautiful gelding there....that might or might not have been mistaken for a mare out in a pasture. Sire line Rabdan, dam line, Kuhailan Rodania, a Kuhailan Ajuz. What makes the guy interesting is that his sire's dam line is nearly identical with Padron! Would imagine he is a lovely, smooth riding horse...If he is dark bay...would imagine he is somewhat rounded with no sharp angles...a very pleasant individual.
Jayne, Your husband will come to love him because he is one of those horses that will win over everyone meeting him after awhile. You've a special guy there!
Moosie, That little girl can outrun the wind if she wanted to but she is too darn smart for her own good! And she has convinced everyone she is more closely related to Ferdinand-would rather smell the flowers than deal with those overly demanding, idiot humans!...Ergo you picked her up at Ascot fairly reasonably is my bet. Now here is the deal...she may not win a beauty contest BUT bred properly and hand raising that foal to mind and love you above all others...and then...with you riding...will win the Grand National or whatever the big race is! See the problem with Pacific Way is she goes back to *Werdi, a Davenport, and is a Kuhailan Krush..so the potential for beauty actually is there...but it is that smooth body and super intelligence that has won your heart! And she loves you right back! Breed her to a Seglawi Carmargue son...and you will think you have died and gone to heaven...The baby would be a stunner and probably fast as anything out there if not faster!
Fee-If Polianka were a doctor, I would trust her with my life. She is truly a phenomenal mare in pedigree, beauty and character. Unless brain damaged, I don't think you could find much better. She is smart enough but will always need you in a pinch to think for her...and would never dream of doing anything to harm.
(Right back to continue this...my machine has been crashing so want to be sure to have this on line...)
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Egbert
Gold Member
USA
1051 Posts |
Posted - 27 Oct 2006 : 06:02:22 AM
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Fee, In re Krackatoa...double check his name spelling...on the Datasource his name is spelled with a C and his dam in awesome! She had 21 foals!!!!!!!!!Next, the operative word for this horse is super sweet/kind...all things being equal and he was probably gelded (?) because he was too low key but his pedigree screams great beauty when he turns on-which is fairly rare!
Marie, Think you would get something similar to Imad...The mare is a kuhailan tracing back to the Polish mare, Sahara...She is robust, lots of scope and a powerful mover...Would expect that a cross to Silver Sandpiper...who would be quite refined but a good mover as well .... could only produce a very beautiful, powerful moving horse the likes of those found at Al Waha. |
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Marie-Molly
Gold Member
United Kingdom
929 Posts |
Posted - 27 Oct 2006 : 08:31:03 AM
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Hi Egbert,
Spot on on the mare, Gwinnie is a lovely substancial girl. About Silver Sandpiper, you may be suprised! Here he is below:
photo copied from the Sandpiper Arabians http://www.sandpiperarabians.co.uk/website |
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Edited by - Marie-Molly on 27 Oct 2006 08:36:13 AM |
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tamila
Platinum Member
England
2532 Posts |
Posted - 27 Oct 2006 : 08:32:38 AM
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Joanna, Having looked at Tara's pedigree I canot believe that she has the Sbeyel bloodlines. My horses are grand offspring of The Lady Katerine who was Sidi bout Sbeyel's full sister. It is quite a rare line and I have only come across it once or twice before. They have the most fantastic temperament whioch goes on from generation to generation.
The aloof also seems to be there but mainly on the female side the boys are all very loving and want attention. |
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Edited by - tamila on 27 Oct 2006 08:36:50 AM |
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Egbert
Gold Member
USA
1051 Posts |
Posted - 27 Oct 2006 : 09:35:39 AM
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Marie,
He looks exactly as I expected! Wow! Thank you!
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Edited by - Egbert on 27 Oct 2006 09:36:19 AM |
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Honeyb060674
Platinum Member
United Kingdom
4301 Posts |
Posted - 27 Oct 2006 : 09:42:44 AM
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Honey B, Safraan is an honest mare...or will be absolutely so with those she loves. That isn't to say she couldn't be full of mischief...With a son...would bet that he would be a rare character, full of fun, mischief and could become downright dangerous in the near future. There is a lot of intelligence there, to say the least
Thanks Egbert You have hit the nail on the head about Honeys (Safraan) honesty. She had a bad few years before I bought her, at the age of 13. Although she clearly still has memories of her treatment, she will allow certain people to gain her trust. Shes extremely box proud, to the point that people who don't know her would be in fear for their lives(lots of teeth gnashing, eyes rolling and lunging across the stable). Shes basically all talk, lots of threats but as gentle as they come.
VERY clever and intelligent...she spends ages hiding behind the other horses when she doesn't really want to be caught, then she finally stands still after 10-15 minutes as though to say "Ok you may catch me now mum"
It great to have someone such as yourself, with boundless knowledge and also kind enough to share it with us. I'm sure everyopne will agree we have all learned so much from you Egbert |
Claire & Sunny x
http://sunnyandclaire.blogspot.com/ |
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baymops
Gold Member
United Kingdom
1108 Posts |
Posted - 27 Oct 2006 : 09:48:57 AM
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Thanks so much Egbert. You have almost got Mazeer down to a tee! A lot of people even now mistake him for a mare and he is a lovely smooth ride. The only thing different is he does have a peaky croup although his front end more than makes up for it! He is a very happy chap and describing him as a pleasant individual sums him up perfectly.
Thanks again, I am amazed at how you can sum him up better than me - you have never met him and I spend all of my spare time with him! |
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Egbert
Gold Member
USA
1051 Posts |
Posted - 27 Oct 2006 : 10:10:33 AM
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Honey B, Thank you. There is so much to learn from these horses...but it really isn't that hard given the time and opportunity to find out about them....In a few seconds information can be shared that saves the reader years of study...so the next step can be reached more quickly, hopefully. The bloodlines available to you in the UK-particularly those from Crabbet-are literally the best foundation to be found anywhere in the world. It must only be remembered that when horseman of the world were collecting, it was the British who led, were willing to pay and thanks to their power as the world leader - every effort was made from both sides to ensure that the creme de la creme wended it's way to the UK. Additionally, Lady Wentworth seems to have had a plan in that the best horses were retained in the UK while the next groups were sent on to the English speaking worlds...In this way it will come back but with generations in between to refresh the blood on both sides of the continent(s)...She also, if I am reading correctly, seemed to send more Rodanias to the US; more Dajania's to Australia, and a healthy mix to So. Africa...but with more emphasis on the Sobha. There is little doubt she was thinking ahead---just as todays breeders should always be thinking two generations ahead of each breeding!
What is so important to remember with these horses...and my point with a future son of Safraan for example...care has to be exercised in training and working with them. They aren't like other horses...the Arabian is so intelligent that it is sometimes easy to forget that they aren't human and don't realize that they have limits...Ergo we, their humans have to be able to set the parameters they can't cross. Fortunately a loud voice is often sufficient as long as it isn't over-used. And praise must always outpace a negative- by 6 to 1. Horses, particularly Arabian horses are like humans in that they have a very keen sense of justice. Do hope this makes sense and I'm not rambling too much.
Baymops,
Thank you. Am curious...are you doing any stretching exercises with him? One of my horses used to have a very peaky croup...and my vet had me ride him briskly (running walk/slow trot) up and down hills for at least a half hour every day. It stretched his croup and he was nearly tabletop after a year! |
Edited by - Egbert on 27 Oct 2006 10:18:17 AM |
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Tail Female Line....?
