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BabsR
Platinum Member
England
2790 Posts |
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MinHe
Platinum Member
England
2927 Posts |
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MinHe
Platinum Member
England
2927 Posts |
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SueN
Bronze Member
England
169 Posts |
 Posted - 08 Apr 2009 : 8:10:51 PM
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MinHe
Sorry to disagree with you, DEFRA were never involved in the Society's views on joining the CIAA or having anything to do with the French situation with the Anglo Arab.
It is only recently that DEFRA have been contacted, and they have stated all along that there is no legal obligation to join the French, if we choose not to.
Maybe the wrong questions were put to DEFRA! |
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BabsR
Platinum Member
England
2790 Posts |
Posted - 08 Apr 2009 : 8:31:17 PM
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MinHe..........so who is being economical with the truth, yet again??
This lot beggers belief......when are we REALLY going to hear the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth...someone is obviously telling porkies
What a load of tripe, this whole matter is!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Babs
www.SunrayAngloArabianStud.co.uk |
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alistair leslie
Gold Member
England
1036 Posts |
Posted - 10 Apr 2009 : 09:53:31 AM
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I have just received the AGM paperwork ( my fault ,lapsed membership) and read the bit aabout the Hon President .
Actually it is muddled thinking .
It is not reasonable to expect the holder to meet their own expenses whilst on AHS business so no wonder no nominations .
The post needs re drawing to make it attractive .
When one thinks of all the money spent on computers for example it is a small cost to have a figurehead for our Society.
What must the outside world think! |
    
blue moon |
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BabsR
Platinum Member
England
2790 Posts |
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deb a-c
Bronze Member
United Kingdom
188 Posts |
Posted - 10 Apr 2009 : 10:33:22 AM
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I agree with Alistair wholeheartedly in respect of the President's position and how it reflects on the Society's image. There should be a realistic bursary with the position.
I do not know how many people attended the AGM but what I am very disconcerted about is the lack of voting by members. There are 2600 plus members and only 215 voted? Now I am not quite clear whether this total, as shown on the AHS website, represents the postal votes or the total voting but if this is the overall voting total I feel it is a shame that people do not use their voting power. Surely more than 8.5% of members voted?
I really hope I have misread the result, though I do congratulate the members who have been voted onto the Committee. |
Debbie A-C
http://ac-arabian-horses.com |
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pat ww
Platinum Member
United Kingdom
3459 Posts |
Posted - 10 Apr 2009 : 10:53:08 PM
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No I expect the number is right, historically with more members only 400 or so ever voted, about 10 per cent.
What do you expect from a society that we , as breeders are co-erced to be members to register foals at extortionate prices and gives so little back?
Nothing is ever seen to CHANGE, so all you are going to get is apathy. |
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Treasure
Silver Member
England
442 Posts |
Posted - 11 Apr 2009 : 07:05:46 AM
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I think the voting pattern is probably quite comparable with many other societies and membership charities. Most members often don't know the people nominated except by reputation and in the AHS that has tended to be whether they have well known horses rather than their own attributes and contributions.
I wasn't able to be at the AGM this year but am strongly against the abolition of President. I believe it is important to have a figure head with really good interpersonal skills who can bring people together with a common purpose - and this should be a core function of the society and paid for by the AHS, of course. It is completely unreasonable to expect a person to fund the work themselves and I think the lack of nominations has proved that. The post needs re-defining and I don't personally think that changing the President on an annual basis is helpful either - a three year appointment would bring far more benefits and the post holder would get to be far better known by members.
Another way would be, I believe, for the AHS to have a Chief Executive who would manage and lead the Society and carry out the PR role encompassed within that 'figurehead' position. I have been harping on about that with no success for ages but I think it would lead and manage the society's affairs much better and take the burden off the Council members who between them have those tasks. I noted a few weeks ago a similar breed society advertising such a post so it can (and should) be done.
As for 'nothing changing' that was why the Members' Voice got together last year and we have got several representatives on Council and Committees, but although the AHS is a small organisation it is like turning a liner to get change - but surely it is happening. We have people there now who are working hard and gradually breaking down the old entrenched views that gave Council a very bad name in recent years. There still is a lot to do and don't forget any member can be nominated if they feel they could do better! Mind you a Strategic Plan would help set a Change Agenda  - how many times have said that in AGMs?! |
Carolyn
Johaara Arabians |
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Annie Oakley
Bronze Member
United Kingdom
175 Posts |
Posted - 13 Apr 2009 : 01:22:46 AM
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Hi all
As a mere ordinary member, not exactly "!bursting with 0 levels"!!, can someone please explain in words of one syllable (sp).what the big issue is with someone being a president of the AHS??
Do they have to have "loads a money" to fulfill their duties?? ie traveling to foreign parts representing the British AHS or wot??
What is the criteria to become a President??
Can an ordinary "Joe Soap" be nominated or wot??
Is there a "President's Allowance" funded by the AHS to enable him/her to carry out their duties, or do they have to be mega rich??
Just purely a matter of interest and would appreciate an "idiot's guide" to becoming a President of the AHS!!
All comments gratefully received, especially the only member of the Council who will dare to comment on this forum ie. the lovely Miss Heather Brown!!!
Cheers
Annie |
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Sahir
Gold Member
England
847 Posts |
Posted - 13 Apr 2009 : 09:30:33 AM
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Hi Heather - can you tell me when the matter of MAI forms will go before the SB&R committee, I ask as I've a foal that I wish to register & the last time I registered a foal I'd completed the description fully & accurately, sent it to Windsor House who returned it to me to be signed by my vet, he wouldn't sign it without coming out to see the foal and checking my written description, this he did & added ONE WORD!! I'd written 'whorl on crest' & he added the word UPPER. For that addition I was charged £70-00 being the call out charge plus checking my written description!!
A licence to print money is the phrase that springs to mind with vets but if the matter of the MAI forms was discussed at the AGM it would be very useful if it went before the SB&R Committee sooner rather than later  I want to register my foal fairly soon (before end of the month ideally)so would be very grateful to hear when it's likely to be discussed. I do know that some breeders command of the English language leaves an awful lot to be desired  but surely those of us who are capable of describing an animal accurately should be allowed to submit their form without the very high costs associated with call charges from their vet.
Elaine x |
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Heather Brown
Gold Member
United Kingdom
682 Posts |
Posted - 13 Apr 2009 : 10:32:52 AM
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MAI Forms
The next SB&R meeting will be in early May.
On 2008 covering certificates (for 2009 foals) it says 'countersigned by vet' - some charge for checking and signing, mine doesn't if here on other work. However after 1st July it will need to be signed by vet when he microchips (by law) so will get charged and doing description should be included in cost.
President
By the memorandum and articles a candidate for president should have been a member of the society for 10 years and made a significant contribution to the furtherance of the objects (of the charity) or are highly regarded in the equestrian world and be approved by the Trustees of the charity.
We had no nominations for this role.
Signing out of this thread now - I came on just to correct some stated errors. I debate the issues in the council meetings and don't feel I can talk on behalf of the AHS on this forum, I am just one of 12. Of course if any of you have further issues you want to raise do feel free to call, email or write to me or any other Council member - details can be found on the AHS website.
Everyone I spoke to after the AGM felt it was a very positive experience - those who didn't come put it in your diary for next year. |
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pintoarabian
Gold Member
Scotland
1242 Posts |
Posted - 13 Apr 2009 : 10:37:26 AM
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| Very well articulated Elaine! Spiralling costs only mean that more people simply aren't going to bother registering and that is only going to create an almightly mess down the line with even more Arabs out there that no-one wants. The AHS will ultimately be the losers. Surely it is better to facilitate registrations and keep costs down to try to attract more members, not lose them as paying members or through apathy, as the response to the recent Council Elections indicated. The current economic climate requires thinking outside the box for organisations/businesses/charities to survive. I have been a member of the AHS for over 35 years, did return my voting paper and have spent thousands of pounds on registration fees, import fees, DNA fees, stallion licensing fees, blood typing fees and the list goes on and on and on. I feel that I have been a loyal supporter of the AHS during this time but am seriously beginning to question what the future holds. This post is in no way a criticism of anyone within the AHS but I do think that creative thinking needs to be a high priority with the intention of reducing members' costs, not increasing them and this has to happen in the very near future, not just the talking about it. Members need to see action and not just hear second hand about talking about issues on committees. Communication leaves a lot to be desired and members should not be finding out information on public forums. This only leads to speculation and back-biting, as has been proven many times before. Let's hear things from the horse's mouth.(pardon the pun!) Then, our judgements can be made from factual, not speculative, information. |
http://www.performancearabians.com
http://performancearabians.blogspot.com/
https://www.facebook.com/PerformanceArabians
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Di Ellis
Silver Member
United Kingdom
415 Posts |
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CINDERS
Gold Member
England
750 Posts |
Posted - 17 Apr 2009 : 1:56:40 PM
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Controversially I believe that from a Welfare standpoint the cost of registration should be far greater than it currently is. Imposition of a high charge would maybe prevent overbreeding in the long run, the society would have the benefit of the increased fees to cover the decrease in registrations and the breed would benefit by having a "rarity" value and less horses ending up in unsuitable homes
As regards the president I do think we need a figurehead but as a regional group would expect this person to show an interest in us and our work which none of the past honorary presidents have done. Yest anyone could be nominated but I do believe it needs to be someone who can relate to persons from all walks of life in the wider equestrian world. I would not like to see a bursary but would think that reasonable necessary proven expenses should be covered. A three year appointment is not a bad idea but I think it should be voted upon annually with the person being required to stand down for a minimum period after 3 years before seeking reelection. This allows the society to get rid of someone who proves to be unsuitable on an annual basis rather than having to wait for the end of their 3 year term and also allows a good candidate to stand for reelection after a suitable period has elapsed
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Yvonne |
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BabsR
Platinum Member
England
2790 Posts |
Posted - 17 Apr 2009 : 2:51:04 PM
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Agree with you on all points raised pintoarabian. Likewise, a Member for almost four decades. Many registered homebred Anglos,over the years and our homebred stallions, responsible for creating innumerable registrations and Memberships through Clients foals.
Actions speak louder than words...Forward plans need to be put in place which will revitalise and encourage new Owner/Breeders to join the AHS and bolster up the ever decreasing Membership figures
Babs
www.SunrayAngloArabianStud.co.uk |
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pat ww
Platinum Member
United Kingdom
3459 Posts |
Posted - 17 Apr 2009 : 3:08:04 PM
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Controvesrsial indeed Yvonne. There is already a long history of unregistered Arabians and part breds, almost every single one is down to the COST of registration. The foal owner at that time not being forward thinking enough to see that their foal will be any lesser a horse for lack of a piece of paper.
Big mistake. down the line someone WILL want to do the classes only to find this UN-registered animal can't take part. Likklihood of being passed from pillar to post. Is this the welfare issue you contemplated by raising fees that are already out of all proportion to the costs of other breed societies or SPECIES of animals. Farm stock is a mere few pounds, not pushing a hundred with breeding stock entry fees to follow.
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BabsR
Platinum Member
England
2790 Posts |
Posted - 17 Apr 2009 : 3:19:03 PM
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Hit the nail on the head there Pat Increased registration fees will not discourage foal production...more likely to lead to an increase in unregistered foals!! 
Babs
www.SunrayAngloArabianStud.co.uk |
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Edited by - BabsR on 17 Apr 2009 3:19:59 PM |
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CINDERS
Gold Member
England
750 Posts |
Posted - 17 Apr 2009 : 4:54:41 PM
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Not a bad point but I have seen this have the right effect in both dog and cat breeding so I would stand by it. I wonder whether a "Non Active" register could be invented for those people who wish to sell fillies but not to be bred from. This could attract the same fee as a gelding. The system has worked for dogs and cats and allows the new owner all rights to show etc but not to breed from the animal. Subject to the agreement of the breeder the animal can be moved to the active register on payment of a fee. The registration certificate is overstamped with the status to prevent anyone selling something that cannot be bred from without telling the purchaser
Non Registration should of course be made clear to the purchaser with all of the pitfalls it involves
Certainly as a small breeder (one foal a year maximum) an increase in the cost makes me think twice about breeding another foal
Maybe I am lucky but like others provided they are there for a visit anyway our vets do the registration docs for nothing so we normally organise it to fit in with the foals first vaccination
IMO one fee that needs to be revised is the transfer of ownership fee as you'd be surprised how many registration I see where the horse has never been transferred
Yvonne
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weirton
Gold Member
873 Posts |
Posted - 17 Apr 2009 : 5:12:38 PM
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One way to stop people breeding a foal and then not registering it because of the cost would be to increase the stud fee to cover the registration fee and for this to be passed to the AHS on the birth of the foal. A degree of honesty would be needed here or perhaps the fee could be sent back to AHS with the covering certificate stubs. This way with a higher stud fee it would make everyone think twice about whether to breed or not.
Just a thought.
On the point of Presidents. We have also been lucky enough to have some very good ones. One lately, who I was most impressed with, visited a lot of the Regional Groups, sponsoring various activities and was very approachable when problems arose and sorted them where it was possible.
Jean
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Edited by - weirton on 17 Apr 2009 5:19:52 PM |
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BabsR
Platinum Member
England
2790 Posts |
Posted - 17 Apr 2009 : 5:33:44 PM
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Cinders....don`t think any decrease in transfer of ownership will encourage new owners (unless they are showing) to transfer into their names....more particularly so with geldings.
This is in fact very frustrating for the Breeder, who tries to keep contact with foals they have bred to log future Performances, Show
Results etc., which can be of considerable value, when assessing breeding programmes
In our experience, Owners wanting a ridden horse for general all round Competition Showing, are not particularly interested in bloodlines.....if they like what they see and enjoy riding the horse,
most will buy with little regard to the breeding...Again this being more the case with gelding owners, who are the ones less likely to apply for transfer of ownership.
Unfortunately, a Breeders dilemma, when trying to trace homebred stock
 We have been fortunate in that over the years, we have lost track of only a small number of our horses, due to lack on transfer to new keeper.
Babs
www.SunrayAngloArabianStud.co.uk
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Edited by - BabsR on 17 Apr 2009 5:37:21 PM |
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alistair leslie
Gold Member
England
1036 Posts |
Posted - 21 Apr 2009 : 09:41:23 AM
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The task is to make the Arab owner feel they matter. |
blue moon |
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CINDERS
Gold Member
England
750 Posts |
Posted - 21 Apr 2009 : 11:56:09 AM
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| Good idea Weirton - I have also suggested that to protect the innocent the fee should be increased to cover the cost of testing for inherited diseaeses where a test is available. Seems to me that if the AHS were to initiate this then the cost per horse would be cheaper than us all doing our own and moreover the registration document would be able to show the status of the horse thus preventing an unscrupulous stallion owner covering a mare who also carries the same inherited defect. |
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