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T O P I C R E V I E W
delly-b
Posted - 26 Oct 2012 : 12:58:04 PM Sorry but I am sat here feeling really angry at the moment....
The last time my farrier came I had all five of my horses in the yard. I personally would say all my horses are very friendly and wouldnt hurt anyone deliberately.
Whilst he was trimming the pony (back leg) one of the arabs came up and tried it on with the pony as he does. Yes I know this was probably my fault in them all being loose but when he did it, I sent him away whilst still hold pony on head collar. At the same time pony tried to struggle to get away. Consequently the farrier then lifted his hind leg way higher than his hip line. Of course pony struggled with him and tried to get free. In a raised voice I said to the farrier dont lift his leg that high. He got very shouty with me (to be polite) and I held my hand up at him and said in a not too friendly voice "enough". This isnt the first time he has treated the pony in this way. I am more of a person that looks at the bigger picture and saw what was going on and would never have chastised the pony in that way. I accept it was probably the best in not letting the pony put his foot down, but lifting his leg that high????? Make no wonder he struggled and tried to kick out.
I have since found out that he was seen thumping another foal in the head. Supposedly for being naughty and that the owner should be more assertive and not like these "natural horsemanship types" Take that to mean as you will, but I also found out he has been branding my name about and calling my horses dangerous! Well I will just add that this pony is so very dangerous I let my and other children play round him all the time. The worst he has ever done is undo zips to try get at food!
Said foal has also reportedly been weeing with blood in the urine since his farrier visit. Of course this has just confirmed for me, that I no longer want his services. I text him so, and he replied "dont worry, i wasnt going to come anyway"!!! Talk about being professional. He didnt even ask why! though im sure he knows.
Ok, rant over.... but is it just me, or would any of you have your horses treated in this way? I believe as they are my responsibility, it up to me to deal with them, and its not up to anyone else to beat, chastise or anything!
17 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First)
SuziQ
Posted - 26 Oct 2012 : 11:36:26 PM I have been very lucky with my farrier, he does like them to be in and ready for his visit but he is a busy man with lots of pressure on his time. I make sure he gets a hot drink and something to eat, Bacon sarnies always popular! The worse he has given any of my horses is a elbow when they have tried to lean on him or a short sharp tug and 'no' on the headcollar when we had a loan pone who thought rearing was the way to go! I am sure that you will find a lovely new farrier soon and learn from this experience going forward.
Slave 2 Magic
Posted - 26 Oct 2012 : 10:04:19 PM Adele, which farrier is it? PM please. If you need the name of a good one let me know.
RUTHIE
Posted - 26 Oct 2012 : 9:38:44 PM My three horses are tied up, hooves picked out ready for my farrier. It is my job to make sure that my horses are safe for the farrier to do his job. I have experianced farriers in the past who have 'bullied' my horses and Iam afraid they were sacked on the spot. My present fella has shod my horses for nearly 6 years and he is a gentleman.
carole ferguson
Posted - 26 Oct 2012 : 8:48:47 PM My farrier in Surrey years ago - had always done Astarte from a foal and was really good with her and her mum Ishtar - then I had to change my hours at work - so he would come when I wasn't there. He was then going through a messy divorce - and must have tried to take his frustration out on Asters - who would have none of it. Every time I came home after he had been - there would be a headcollar rope tightly tangled in the baler twine tie - and after a few months he told me my horse was dangerous so he didn't want to shoe her any more - but told me of another farrier who was just starting out and might take her on. I don't like to think what he had obviously done to Asti in my absence - but the new farrier just came over - made a fuss of her - and hot-shod her for the first time with no problems whatsoever. the new farrier said he couldn't understand what had happened with my previous farrier - as Asti was a poppet to do. Whatever happened with the first one - he had only himself to blame as he was the only one to touch her for the first about 7 years of her life.
Cinnypony
Posted - 26 Oct 2012 : 8:39:18 PM Agree not ok to have loose horses milling around whilst trimming, but then if the farrier wasn't happy with the set up I would expected him to ask for the the other horses to be removed to elsewhere or tied up before he started, as he is after all the professional.
However it is not ok for the farrier to use violence against a horse, end of. If they were employed by me, they wouldn't be coming back.
Pauline
Posted - 26 Oct 2012 : 5:25:12 PM To start with it is wrong having loose horses in the yard when one is tied up and being seen to by the farrier or vet. I do see the farriers point of view.
After saying that, the farrier has no business doing something that is wrong.
If any farrier or vet did not treat my horses with respect they would not be allowed into my yard. This has happened once and the farrier was asked to leave (once he had finished the job) and not to come back.
No one abuses my horses in anyway.
I would change farriers and never recommend him to anyone.
garnet
Posted - 26 Oct 2012 : 5:14:44 PM As others have said, I wouldn't want a farrier who handles horses like that, but to have loose horses around while the farrier is working sounds extremely dangerous. Having said that, I am surprised that the farrier did not ask you to stable or tie up the other horses before he started work. I hope you find someone more 'horse-friendly' but remember they do have to think about self-preservation. If you are really unhappy about your farrier you can complain to the WCF. I once did this because our farrier simply didn't turn up but didn't bother to let me know beforehand. Particularly annoying as I live 5 miles from the yard and after I had spent a total of 14 hours, spread over several occasions, waiting for him, I wrote to the WCF and persuaded a friend's farrier to take pity on me.
jillandlomond
Posted - 26 Oct 2012 : 4:20:53 PM Well said HTR and welcome to Alines! Great to see you contributing Let's see some pics of the lovely A to Z in your signature
HTR
Posted - 26 Oct 2012 : 3:11:33 PM I have been using the same farrier and all his many apprentices for the last 20years and at no point have ANY of them treated any of my horses in a way that I would object to. So take heart, there are very decent farriers out there.
I would say I always have everybody haltered in time for their arrival at my field. In my experience bad accidents happen in the blink of an eye so I always err on the side of caution in that sort of situation
It's happened, it's done, and anyone decent who knows you and your ponies will know he's talking rot as they no doubt also know this farrier.
Callisto
Posted - 26 Oct 2012 : 2:53:00 PM I wouldn't be happy about my farrier thumping my horse, but neither would I expect him to shoe my horse with any of the others wandering about. You have to remember that he doesn't know your horses like you do, he is at risk while he is bent over a horse's hoof, and most farriers have bad backs due to the nature of their work (and bad experiences with horses reacting badly to having their feet done). If they get injured then they lose their income, and let all their other clients down (plus the pain of the injury). I don't approve of his reaction, but I do think it is understandable.
ETA When in the past I have had a farrier who was rough and shouty with my horses, he only came the once...
pinkvboots
Posted - 26 Oct 2012 : 2:50:34 PM Trimming and shoeing makes a huge difference, if you are banging sharp nails in a shoe and the horse moves suddenly that nail can do some serious damage to a horses foot, or the farrier thats why you don't want the horse trying to get away.
Although yours are only getting trimmed I still would not leave the others loose in the same area, I know my horses they are really well behaved never kick but I wouldnt tie one up and leeve the other loose while I brushed or picked the other ones feet out, its an accident waiting to happen.
Pasch
Posted - 26 Oct 2012 : 2:24:58 PM Like others I think it's dangerous to have free horses around when shoeing,I know of farriers who won't shoe if conditions aren't perfect meaning a dry hard surface,clean hooves,fly-spray or blanket,others will go fetch the horse themselves and accept more risky situations especially if they are young and need clients. What this guy did(badmouthing,hitting the foal on the head)was bad,but you have to remember they are the ones risking their health or worse under the horse's feet.I think we should all try to be in the same situation before passing judgement on a farrier being harsh on the horse. Again hitting the foal on the head is a no-no!But sometimes an open hand thud on torso will be enough for the horse to behave without causing any harm.That is after good manners have failed!And never in the case of foals or first-timers.
delly-b
Posted - 26 Oct 2012 : 2:18:54 PM I totally agree that they have to be concerned for their safety. i would like to think I would never put someone in that position anyway. The point is, nothing actually happened on my yard apart from the pony trying to move away, until farrier nearly tipped him up lifting his leg so high. (and when I say arab tried it on, all he does is try move him on as horses do, nothing else to it, not even a nip) To me that is brutal force and the old school tactics trying to bully horses into behaving as they want them to.
He wasnt shoeing them.... he was only trimming them. Not that that makes a real difference, but all the same, my horses are all so placid all they do is stand around you. I tend to them all while loose in the yard and there is never a problem,,,, even when I do their feet myself. If it was a problem, there is no way I would let them all be there.... I guess that is knowing your horses though.
pinkvboots
Posted - 26 Oct 2012 : 2:08:02 PM Sorry but having horses loose when one is being shod is not ideal, I am supprised he was happy to do it I know most farriers wouldnt after all he will be the one gettin kicked, at the end of the day he wont be coming back so forget it, can you not shut your other horses in somewhere when they are shod safer for everyone I would think.
And no I wouldnt be happy someone else hitting my horses, I don't hit them so believe no one else should.
joanna_piana
Posted - 26 Oct 2012 : 1:52:00 PM If he did do that to the foal then sounds like you are well rid, however I do think anyone working with horses does put themselves at risk and perhaps having loose horses around when he's trying to shoe is a little unfair.
ali bali
Posted - 26 Oct 2012 : 1:50:30 PM Hmmm, no I dont think you are being unreasonable, they are your horses at the end of the day and you are entitled to handle and discipline them as you see fit. After all you are the one who has to live long term with their behaviour, good or bad! Also bad-mouthing a client to other people is extremely unprofessional so it sounds like you are well shot to be honest.
However I can also see the situation from the farriers point of view. A farrier is self-employed and receives no sick pay if they are injured and so he may have reacted out of concern for his own safety/livelihood.
Having said that the professional approach would have been to politely request that he shoe in a safe environment and refuse to start work until all horses were secured a safe distances from each other. In that way he would have ensured his own and your horses safety and the situation would never have arisen.
ETA I never have a headcollar on any of my horses when I am with them day to day, feeding, picking out feet etc, etc. I even tend wounds loose. I know them well and they know I wont tolerate any nonsense (not even moving each other on when I am working with them!). I also accept that if something happens and I am hurt because they are not restrained then I only have myself to blame! My boys know when to expect a visitor as its the only time they ever see their headcollars LOL. This is because I dont expect my professionals to know or trust my horses like I do, nor do I expect my horses to behave with the same calmness and respect for a stranger as they do for me.
KittyB
Posted - 26 Oct 2012 : 1:46:33 PM Loose horses around whilst the farrier was trying to shoe is a BAD idea for everyone concerned, including horses.
Some farriers are great and others not so great. Whilst I don't condone any thumping, perhaps he was having a bad day made worse? They are ruled by a governing body though, so you might have opportunity to report his behaviour as long as you have evidence.
so I always err on the side of caution in that sort of situation 