| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| mittens |
Posted - 30 May 2010 : 09:46:28 AM
When I was discussing the ways in which we feed our horses these days I came across this article when ordering from the website.What are your thoughts?
Link removed for violation of rule regarding commercial links |
| 25 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| angel2002 |
Posted - 03 Jun 2010 : 2:22:52 PM
I have never heard about soaking oats either Paul.
Many years ago I fed rolled oats(unsoaked), unmolassed chaff, sugar beet and a vit/min supplement to my gelding (he is on loan to the friend who feeds this way). Khan is still fed this way and is 23yrs young this year 
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| paul_brown_arabs |
Posted - 03 Jun 2010 : 10:00:28 AM
interesting article - thanks - have been feeding oats for some time now - since price of processes feeds went thru roof few years back - now alfalfa + soaked beet + oats + balancer + garlic and limestone flour - mixed depending on work loads/needs etc and works fine.
Never heard that oats should be soaked though!
given the short time food actually stays in a horses stomach - think its 15-30 mins before its in small intestine - wouldnt have thought it makes much difference?
i have heard that oats eaten by people should always be presoaked (few hours) or can prevent formation of vitamin b12.
thanks again for the article - will do more digging. |
| Nichole Waller |
Posted - 02 Jun 2010 : 12:32:37 PM
Great thanks  |
| loosefur |
Posted - 01 Jun 2010 : 9:56:47 PM
I wouldn't bother with a balancer at all, if you're feeding pink powder at the recommended amount then that should provide all the vit/mins necessary. You could swap the pink powder for NAF's Slimline - I've heard some good reports about it and it is designed for those with expanding waist lines. Or try the D&H Surelimb - it's far more cost effective than feeding a balancer. I'd definitely consider swapping from the HiFi Good doer (which contains molasses) to Fast Fibre - you won't need to feed much, just enough to hide their supplements in. I'd also cut out the carrots completely as they are packed full of sugar. The first cut hay that is quite green is also not the best thing to feed good doers but if you can't get second cut then if you soak it for twelve hours before you feed it most of the sugars will be leached out. Hope that helps a bit |
| Dot |
Posted - 01 Jun 2010 : 8:40:08 PM
I suggest finding the lowest MJ/KG balancer out there as this way you will minimize there calorie intake and ensure they are getting the right amount of vits and minerals. I would however seriously upp there workload if you want them to loose the weight and cut out the hay when they are in feed good quality oat straw, it is of low calorific value and will keep them chomping and fiber in there bellies. Pretty much every fiber low cal feed is based on oat straw chaff.
It is hard I have the two opposites at the moment a 19 year old lactating mare on buckets of food and an 8 year old gelding (bay in my sig below)doing 5 miles/ 8km of canter work averaging 20kph and building twice a week plus schooling sessions out 24/7 (about 4 acres shared with 20 lambs/sheep and his half brother) and a hand full of balancer that I am struggling to get the weight off of. He looks in good condition, covering on his ribs but not fit, though his heart rate recoveries say he is. If I fed what the feed manufacturers reckon he should be on he would be the size on of a house. His two year old half brother looks just right.
Scientific research is great but you do need to see what is in front of you as well.
Dot |
| Nichole Waller |
Posted - 01 Jun 2010 : 6:12:40 PM
So to gate crash this thread, but it is very interesting and i need some help re feeding my two.
I've had a look on the A & P website and had a read up on the fast fibre. It sounds good...!
My two are both over weight and really need to loose some. They are on re-stricted grass and they get one section of hay when i bring them in a few hours before i ride (It is very green first cut of the year hay)
I was feeding them Lo cal Balancer but they both put on a lot of weight over the winter months  . My vet has advised no short feed at all... but i like them to have their vitamins and minerals and they also both have a joint supplement so i need to give them a little something. At the moment they have a really small handful of Hi Fi Good Doer with pink powder and their joint supplement and a few carrots. Do you think the fast fibre will be better (lower calories) than what they are getting at the moment...?
The problem is that unless you feed the recommended amounts they don't get the vits and mins that are in the feed. This means i have to give them quite a lot, where as at the moment they get a really small handful of the hi fi and their supplements. There can't be much calories in this can there...?
Any help appreciated. |
| lehla |
Posted - 01 Jun 2010 : 2:09:10 PM
hi can i ask you people that do feed soaked oats do you soak for 24hrs and how do you drain the soaked oats and how long for do you make fresh up each day thanks lehla |
| littlearabians |
Posted - 31 May 2010 : 7:57:58 PM
I think I will give it a go.... but I can't restrict their grass, as I only have grass fields and paddocks. |
| Montikka |
Posted - 31 May 2010 : 6:16:22 PM
I had many problems with one mare and followed Loosefur's advice regarding feeding - the transformation was remarkable. Baring in mind that our purebreds are all good doers and not in hard work. They have NO CEREALS, high fibre, NO SUGAR (or as little as I can manage) restricted grass and soaked hay. I add oil for some, and seaweed/magnesium for all. I would add oats if they were in hard work or needed to put on condition, and feel that oats have an unfair reputation as being unsuitable.
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| loosefur |
Posted - 31 May 2010 : 4:03:50 PM
I avoid all those pre mixed horse feeds - mixes are worse than cubes/nuts but even so almost all contain molasses, preservatives, mold inhibitors and lots of other nasty things. Yes the horse feed manufacturers have spent years developing these feeds but it's all about them making a profit not us having the healthiest product to feed to our horses. If the latter was the case then they'd stop adding molasses to everything! Urghhh... feed companies are a pet hate of mine! The only mixes I like are Allan & Pages L Mix and Cereal Intolerance Mix - both being molasses free. The Winergy Low Energy mix is also seems safe to feed (and is free from preservatives) - it does contain Molglo, which is a molasses derived additive, but is still low in sugar and starch. However feeding any of these mixes is very expensive and unnecessary. I feed completely unmollassed sugar beet to all mine (Dodson & Horall make it but don't promote it or even have it on their website - but if you ask your feed supplier they will order it in for you), and then a handful of unmolassed chop or Fast Fibre. If anything were to need a bit of extra energy then I would look to add a cup full of oats, organic porridge oats made for humans, as you can be sure there are no nasty chemicals included. I also add a vit/mineral supplement (D&H Surelimb) and all the horses have free access to a Rockies Red Block. |
| littlearabians |
Posted - 31 May 2010 : 1:52:51 PM
I did mean a former horse I owned... sadly Little Hunter got kicked by a warm-blood mare last year and broke his elbow... we had to let him go, only 15 years old.... hurts every day, but life goes on.
I feel very frustrated about the problem with my mare, I haven't got a clue what to do to make her better... the vet has suggested oils, and she gets that... when I fed with oats and Alfa A + vitamin powders she had none of these problems... however the vet says some horses react like that to the English grass as it is very rich in vitamin A, its rarely but it does happen. |
| BabsR |
Posted - 31 May 2010 : 1:27:44 PM
OLD TB....Eleven years is not old!! or do you mean a former horse you owned as in old, not as in age?
Have never owned pure Bred Arabians, but would think that possibly stud nuts may be too rich for certain good doers, except perhaps real oldies
Hope you get your problem solved, such a worry
Babs
www.SunrayAngloArabianStud.co.uk |
| littlearabians |
Posted - 31 May 2010 : 12:46:15 PM
BabsR:
old = flat horse re schooled for showjumping and endurance age at the time 11 years old.
also the A vitamin problem is not him, but my Arab mare who is fed stud mix, not cool mix. |
| mittens |
Posted - 31 May 2010 : 12:25:11 PM
Hmmm, interesting replies!
Firstly making a judgement on a person because they practice iridology seems a bit harsh. I have read a bit about the subject and have seen from experiments that it can lead otherwise healthy people to think they have a life-threatening disease whilst on the flip-side not noticing conditions in people who already had serious illness.But anyway,back to the oats. I am tempted to try the diet but on the other hand slighly concerned that even soaked oats could be a problem for older horses with not so good teeth to grind up. Also with regards to oats causing fizziness I've found barley to have more of a rocket-fuel effect in the past. Alfalfa also has received some bad press but I can't remember the exact reasons for this so I won't try to waffle on about it!
I don't recall the article saying oats could be fed on their own as a total feed and she does say which suppliments would compliment the diet.I agree totally that the ready blended feeds should contain all the vits and minerals required and that adding another thing to the mix would be overloading and although I've been told that horses will "pee out what they don't need" I'm not sure if it's as simple as that.
As with us,we should get all our nutritional requiremnets from the food itself IF we eat the right things,therefore eliminating the need to take vitamin tablets,but lets face it,who realistically has the time to work out the contents of everything we shove down our throats let alone being able to afford 5-a-day of the best fruit and veg available,so for us a multi vitamin is a way of getting what we lack.
Still baffled by live enzymes though! |
| BabsR |
Posted - 31 May 2010 : 12:21:48 PM
Old horses, require a higher level of nutrition to maintain their condition. I would not be feeding a cool mix to veteran Thoroughbreds.
Our old ladies are fed Stud Nuts and Sugar Beet. Stud Nuts are higher in protein and oil and not as high in Vit A as Cool Mix. Our TB mare bred her last foal aged 24years and her condition was such that she could have gone in the showring that year. In fact all our oldies, in excess of 20years live out 24/7 and all look fit and well with good coats.
Little-Maureen aged 24yrs with her newborn Anglo Colt
We recommend stud nuts for all real oldies, with the exception of laminitics based on our own experience over the many years we have been breeding our Anglos
www.SunrayAngloArabianStud.co.uk
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| littlearabians |
Posted - 31 May 2010 : 11:24:54 AM
I'm having problems with my mare on commercial feeds for the first timer ever...
she is loosing some of her coat, and vet has done all sorts of tests... at the moment her vitamin A levels are too high, and she is lacking essential fatty acids.
I really don't know what to feed her anymore, you buy ready mixed stud mix as it's supposed to be the best, and then you end up with problems like this.
last time i had problems regarding feed was also a commercial mix... spillers cool mix... my old TB got very very poorly, and blood samples reveled that the vitamin levels was completely wrong, in spite the fact that I was feeding what the spillers feed consultant recommended me.
I'm thinking if this oat diet might be the thing for me... |
| Zan |
Posted - 31 May 2010 : 09:41:52 AM
Hmmm---horses did used to appear be fitter but they weren't clinically obese as most horses are these days, which is not down to modern compound feeds, but due to the fact that owners overfeed them the wrong kind of feed and do not exercise them enough. Obesity leads to all sorts of problems in horses from the obvious ones, like laminitis and joint problems, to less obvious, such as skin problems.Keep your horses slim and they will live longer, healthier, happier lives.
I agree with Dot that there is nothing at all "natural" about this diet--where would soaked oats and cooked barley and linseed feature in the life of a wild horse? The "natural" way to feed horses is fibre, fibre and more fibre. There are plenty of well balanced, nutrionally sound feeds based on fibre these days.
I would also point out that, in the "good old days", horses were considered very old in their mid teens, and it was very unusual for their working life to go on beyond that. They also tended to be killed rather than retired when their working lives were over ( big generalisation I know---some people probably kept their old friends but it wasn't usual), so not many ever had a chance to show old age related illnesses. |
| jackiedo |
Posted - 31 May 2010 : 09:26:05 AM
I feed straights. Started this last winter with a rescued TB in poor condition on the advice of a nutritionist, complicated as the horse was so severely claustrophobic it would not be stabled. The mare lived out all winter (with another TB and Aged Arab mare) up to christmas without rugs too.
they got soaked oats, sugarbeet and alfalfa twice a day, with AD lib hay and extra biotin (as the mare had very poor feet) OK they did no work, but they had lots of energy and came out of winter in fabulous body condition with good coat and hooves. I have to add that my aged TB had a throat tumour and the rescue one had an underlying problem that had been seriously neglected in her last home that necessitated them being PTS on vet advice, but condition wise they did very well |
| Dot |
Posted - 31 May 2010 : 08:57:33 AM
There is nothing natural about feeding cooked feeds to animals that evolved to eat raw food. All cooking does is predigest indigestible carbohydrates in the food source increasing the calorific value of the feed.
Dot |
| Nedds71 |
Posted - 31 May 2010 : 07:16:27 AM
Keren,
If you read the diet through you will realise that the horses DON'T get oated up, by soaking the oak you remove the startch. Its the startch collecting in the hind gut of the horse that can make them loopy loo!
Anything with sweat itch or skin problems show huge improvement on this diet. I have a mare that I've had for 14 years always suffered with sweat itch having been on the oat diet for 12 months this summer she is alot better in her skin, and where she has rubbed the healing is much quicker. |
| Anne C |
Posted - 30 May 2010 : 10:51:49 PM
We must do or we wouldn't be able to cope with their 'specialness'!! Boys!!
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| Vera |
Posted - 30 May 2010 : 10:45:03 PM
LOL 'special' or high maintenance!! But we love them don't we  |
| Anne C |
Posted - 30 May 2010 : 10:39:37 PM
Dennis is 'special' in't Vera? Just like Eldor, ordinary feed just wont do lol
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| MinHe |
Posted - 30 May 2010 : 10:27:51 PM
One point the article fails to make is that horses in the past worked a damn sight harder than they do today, which is *why* they were fitter!
Having been fallen on by a horse that was 'oated up', I must admit to feeling somewhat leery of this diet!
Keren |
| Vera |
Posted - 30 May 2010 : 12:38:08 PM
I agree with you too Babs, my other horses are fed a 'commercial' feed. The only thing I add to their diet is unpasturised Apple Cider Vinigar.
But in the instance of where you horse has a problem - in Dennis's case a mysterious itch and proof that he has intolerances to certain foods, this diet is really worth considering. |
