| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| ACGODFREY |
Posted - 16 Feb 2010 : 7:44:44 PM
I am used to the arab sensitivity and, in particular, the spooking. I have had my older boy for 10 years and he is a particularly alert and cautious soul. However, my other boy is even worse . He is 6 and due to vet problems, only really started his education properly last year. We are lucky to have an indoor school at the yard in which I school/lunge him 3 times a week, and have done for the past 8 months! He is an excessively over reactive spooker, and it's getting worse. I still think it is very genuine, but every time I have ridden him for the last few weeks, I have had a 'near miss'. Last night, despite having good 'stick-ability', I ended up head first hanging off the side of him with one leg hooked over the saddle while he bucked and bucked. I somehow saved myself, but the magnitude of his spook and spin reactions are huge  . There is literally no warning, nor any stimulus that I am aware of (and I believe I am particularly astute to these things).
Advice please on how to deal with this. Under saddle he is averse to one end of the school, yet is quite happy to head up there under free turnout and investigate everything with lots of enthusiasm. He is quite sensitive to the leg, and prone to anxiety, so 'strong' riding doesn't have the desired effect. He does not work in a destracted way, in fact quite the opposite, so I don't know how to focus his attention any more . Nor does he spook on one rein in particular, or at one specific area in the school. He is equally poor on the lunge, but I will persevere with that approach. Am self-employed and acutely aware that if I am physically incapacitated as a result of a fall, it will have significant consequences. Help!! |
| 12 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| dinkidoo |
Posted - 18 Feb 2010 : 07:59:24 AM
You could be describing riding my boy! Luckily over the years he has mellowed somewhat and his spooks are less frequent but in the early days we could be cantering along a track and he would 360 and we would suddenly be the other way facing my mum cantering towards us! I can't believe ive never come off him! He is also very very stressy and sometimes i have to force myself to get on him. Luckily since the move to the new yard where we can hack without meeting anyone he has improved greatly. I don't school him as such at the moment as he's now 10 and only doing happy hacking which seems to suit him better. I never ride him on the roads though, if there is a road section i always dismount and he will only ride out in company.
Like you say strong riding doesn't have any effect as when upset there isn't much you can do to settle them again.
All i can say is give it time and when you do start to hack out give him a routine that he feels comfortable with, Dinki doesn't even like to have his route changed I think some horses are just like this! They are all the more rewarding though when they start to come right |
| ACGODFREY |
Posted - 17 Feb 2010 : 9:10:35 PM
Thanks for your input - I feel better knowing it's not just me that has a mega spooker. I had penned a big essay reply but have lost it.
Anyway, to cut a long story short, this horse was diagnosed with navicular and bone spur on stifle aged 4, followed by serious accident in field involving a gate hinge bolt aged 5. He had 16 months of 'nothing' and was brought back into work in hand and under saddle under vet and physio supervision last summer. He remains sound and we are all surprised and thrilled with his progress. This restricts what I choose to do with him - no tight turns, no jumping, fast work etc. which doesn't help this issue. He enjoys hacking in company - likes to lead and, although bold, is very over reactive. Ground conditions also quite new to him as he is used to the good surface in the school, not undulating ground. Not good on the road so our hacking is xmas tree forestry in which ground conditions terrible Oct-March following 'harvest', so no hacking yet. Once I can hack in company I will - it will benefit him hugely mentally and physically.So, I am restricted with what I can do in the school which won't help. Have ridden when jumps were up etc. and placed 'obstacles' in the school, but his spooks are such that we have near misses with them. Would like to stress that he is working well, on the bit and from behind, when he does this! He is not looking in the direction of the spook, nor does he start to fall onto the shoulder furthest away from whatever he spooks at, nor does an ear move in that direction, nor does his rhythm change - these are exactly what my other boy does and at least indicate to me he is thinking about it!
I will lunge in 'sensible' company tomorrow and see what he does. He has managed to induce anxiety in a previously sedate horse before with his behaviour! It's a tricky situation but possible perpetuated by the fact that is his only work place.
Thanks again |
| Roseanne |
Posted - 17 Feb 2010 : 10:32:04 AM
I sympathise, cos it's one of those things that mean you can never really get to relaxing on a ride!
Just a couple of thoughts: first I think the spooking at one place in the school is very much an 'association' thing. Something genuinely spooked the horse there and he remembers. These Arabs really do have brains like elephants and are hugely aware of everything. My sister's horse ALWAYS shies to start with along one side of the school where our neighbours cat used to lurk in the hedge. The mare isn't stupid - she knows there's something alive in there sometimes.
I do believe some of these creatures, which have evolved over so many thousands of years in desert conditions with expanses of ground into the distance with odd outcrops of rocks, are still instinctively wary in our English countryside world, with its hedges, trees and things there to hide the mountain lions that MUST be lurking (in your horse's subconscious).
And I think some Arabs are more prone to this by their natures. I have had two Arab youngsters, both of whose mothers were very nervous specimens, and both were extremely spooky; one dangerously so - frightened of every blade of grass! So I believe it is passed down from mother to foal, and in their characteristic genes (if that makes sense!).
I have a young stallion here whose temperament is totally the opposite; the worst he will do is to edge away from something that's new or odd; he won't leap and unsettle the rider. But from what I hear, he has inherited that as his parents were also very sedate.
Could I suggest long-reining so you're in control and can correct his head (so's not to be concentrating on the nearside verge) and also drive him on if he starts to object to something? Longreining with a companion horse and rider to start with can be very useful to get him used to walking out positively, even though you're not 'leading'.
I guess he may always be one of those spooky Arabs, but I'm sure you can help him to become more courageous.
I don't want to be teaching grandmother to suck eggs either, but I believe you must always, as rider, take responsibility to be aware of where you are and what ground you're going over, so you never take him over ground that could be a danger to him (e.g. over manholes where he may slip or through a river you aren't sure is firm underfoot) because he will eventually learn to trust that you never take him anywhere dangerous, and that will give him added confidence.
Good luck with him. |
| zooscat |
Posted - 17 Feb 2010 : 09:34:13 AM
Well done for hanging on! Ryazan can be a complete spook monster - and it is usually in the school, as he's too interested in what's going on when I hack out - although he can put in a good sideways leap (especially in trot and canter) when "things" appear in the hedge or fly out of it  ! A particularly good one was when he saw a gent's bottom appearing backwards out of a hedge !!! (he said he was "trying to retrieve the ferrets!!") In the school he is a little time bomb after about 10minutes, cos he has a very short attention span; polework, serpentines - anything at all that keeps him occupied on what we are doing, rather than being able to predict it in his clever horsey brain. I've tried all the calmers on the market but they dont seem to make much difference after a while. Mind over matter? Ry even props and spooks across the school with my trainer, who is a really good rider and loves him to bits (fortunately!) I've done and continue to do all the "right things" back checked regularly, pelvis ditto, teeth every six months, "tactful" riding etc etc. I think perhaps your Super Spooker may settle a bit more when he is more used to being "educated" and perhaps got over the after effects of the vet problems? Might be an idea, as suggested previously, to have someone else and if poss their horse, in the school with you. May calm him down, and will give you moral support. I had three lessons a week on Ry when I first got him, mainly because I needed a good set of eyes on the ground, and someone I trusted to tell me it was all alright, not my fault and to just keep going and go back to what we were doing before I fell off! Oh - and wear a back protector! Best of luck! |
| saddlebred |
Posted - 17 Feb 2010 : 07:21:56 AM
He sounds quite similar to my young mare who is also highly sensitive and very intelligent. I can hack her out no problem in all sorts of traffic but when I ride her in the school she will usually spook quite dramatically with a series of plunges as you describe. Not bucking but boinging very high about 6 times. Its a horrible feeling.
I have figured out that I am now anticipating her reaction which she is picking up on. When my trainer rides her she doesnt even think about doing it.
Have you thought about breaking the cycle and just getting someone else to ride her in the school a few times to see if she still does it?
I hope you get it sorted. I know that it is very frustrating and unnerving. |
| mogwai |
Posted - 17 Feb 2010 : 07:03:44 AM
Just a thought, but you say he'd had health problems, what were they? Could they be linking to the spooking? You also mentioned he's a lot worse under saddle and whilst lunging, if he has a physical problem he may be ok when limiting himself, but find things more difficult when having a pace and direction dictated to him.
I hope you get him sorted. Some great advice on here as ever.
Ros |
| Mrs Vlacq |
Posted - 16 Feb 2010 : 10:39:45 PM
You could try giving him something else to focus on in the bogey areas. So teach hima manouvre over/through poles, small jump or similar in a quieter place, then move the apparatus about randomly, into and away from the bogey places. Also, dont' stick to conventional turns and circles when schooling. Go everywhere in eratic directions with loads of transistions that make his mind work harder than his body. The more 'into' his work he is, the more he will be with you, less likely to escape sideways from underneath you.
I sympathise - I have a few that are just as quirky and you feel mean riding them every step of the way, but keeping him focussed should help. Wearing him out will only make him resent work. Give him lots of stuff to do, even if it's all at walk and trot. And get him into some company or larger rides. So he get ridden at, overtaken, passed and left standing. Desensitise him by jamming the radio on loud etc.
Good luck...... and well sat! |
| joanna_piana |
Posted - 16 Feb 2010 : 10:31:59 PM
Is he just bored and looking for things to spook at - what's he like out hacking? Shida was a spooky mare and when feeling full of herself would look for things to spook at particularly in familiar places, the further afield we went the less she'd spook as she'd be too interested in new surroundings. Ishara isn't spooky as everything is far too interesting which makes a lovely change, however she does spook occasionally when bored. |
| gg |
Posted - 16 Feb 2010 : 9:01:59 PM
How about having another horse in the school that is confident and not spooking? Your horse may gain confidece from this. Or perhaps doing pole work to channel his mind!!!!
Good luck
julie |
| ACGODFREY |
Posted - 16 Feb 2010 : 8:49:46 PM
Hi Jill,
He gets NAF General purpose supplement at recommended levels with his diet chaff, so I'd like to think his magnesium levels are ok. Having said that, he is rather peculiar, so maybe it's something to look into.
You are right about the indoor, but even though that end is the 'bogey end' he still spooks magnificantly at other points, although perhaps his focus is on that end at the time?
I had wondered whether this is starting to become a napping issue as he is very smart but the magnitude of the spooks and his reaction is such I'm not sure. My other boy does the spooking as an evasion, and these seem quite different. Something I need to consider though. He is generally an excessively over reactive boy, hence not venturing much onto the roads, but mighty rewarding at the same time!
Hope you have found yourself somewhere nice! |
| loosefur |
Posted - 16 Feb 2010 : 8:45:07 PM
I feel your pain. My gelding Hajar has a huge spook on him - to the extent he actually fell over whilst spooking last year. He sounds the same as your lad - loose school him and he'll invesigate every corner of the school without a single spook but riding or lunging could be interesting! The only thing I found that made any difference was to give him a calmer - Blue Chip Karma was the one that seemed to work. It did make a massive difference and cut the number of spooks by about 80% and the magnitude of the spooks when they did still happen from massive to manageable.
He is also better in strange places - hire a school somewhere he's never been before and he doesn't spook at all but ride in the same school and it's a spook free for all. He can be perfectly focused in his work and then suddenly I can be hanging round his ears for no apparent reason. I have to say he has got much better these last couple of years but he's 14 this year and I reckon he's finally growing up! He's a very cheeky, very bright personality and in the end I just had to accept that spooks were his sense of humour.
So I would say try Blue Chip Karma first and second keep his work as varied as possible... take him new places and see if he spooks less, hack him out lots, again varying the routes. If he's like my lad he'll always be spooky but it should be manageable but keeping his brain engaged is the key.
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| jillandlomond |
Posted - 16 Feb 2010 : 8:32:39 PM
Hi Anne,
Do you have your boy on any supplements to promote calmness? He may well be low in magnesium, and adding this to the diet can help some horses significantly!
It could also be a form of napping
I know of several horses that spook at the far end of the indoor school at Hynshawland, and I reckon it's the electric fence energiser clicking that upsets them. Could you try switching it off just for the hour whilst you're schooling?
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