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szedlisa
Bronze Member


Spain
124 Posts

Posted - 25 Feb 2009 :  9:44:38 PM  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add szedlisa to your friends list Send szedlisa a Private Message  Reply with Quote

Vanbro,

It sounds more as if that foal had LFS., Lavender Foal Syndrome.
You can read more about LFS at www.foal.org
The strange coloring has a lot to do with it.
That is just a guess on my part. Can you remember what its breeding was?

Lisa

Originally posted by vanbro

Sometimes you get an AHAA! moment and you start to think back.
I bred a filly from my mare years ago and at the time I just thought the filly was a victim of a 'birth accident' ie cerebral palsy/cerebral anoxia. She was unable to stand , was having spasms and also she as a strange colour too,for an Arab, if that is of any significance!!!!
I had her put down almost immediately.
I know that the mare never ever had another foal like that, or even lost a foal,but I don't know about the stallion.
Maybe that foal had CA ???
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vanbro
Bronze Member


United Kingdom
93 Posts

Posted - 26 Feb 2009 :  7:08:39 PM  Show Profile  Send vanbro an AOL message Bookmark this reply Add vanbro to your friends list Send vanbro a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Yes I do remember the breeding and incidentally when I talked to my friend about it she had one of similar bloodlines around the same time. Will look at LFS and see if that fits....

VANBRO -
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gsarrow
New Member


11 Posts

Posted - 03 Mar 2009 :  02:29:08 AM  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add gsarrow to your friends list Send gsarrow a Private Message  Reply with Quote
here are some links to annoucements regarding CA and Lavendar foals.....
New Genetics Task Force: http://www.thehorse.com/ViewArticle.aspx?ID=13698
LFS/CCDL : http://www.thehorse.com/ViewArticle.aspx?ID=13706&src=LN

Site with info and links on CA
http://zaphina.tripod.com

Help prevent CA Affected foals Test before you breed. Visit the CA Web site for Info
http://www.cerebellar-abiotrophy.org/
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szedlisa
Bronze Member


Spain
124 Posts

Posted - 16 Mar 2009 :  11:41:10 PM  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add szedlisa to your friends list Send szedlisa a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Originally posted by szedlisa

For all concerned with CA ( cerebellar abiotrophy), here is a list to date of horses that have been tested and have had their test results published on public forums or webpages. CA affects all bloodlines so this includes all bloodlines:

To order CA TEST FORMS from UC Davis , please do so here:
http://www.vgl.ucdavis.edu/services/horse.php

For assistance with ordering the test online, contact the VGLís Customer Service section by phone (530) 752-2211, FAX (530) 752-3556 or email: http://www.vgl.ucdavis.edu/contact/email.php

Samples from horses outside the USA *ARE* accepted. The package containing the samples will need a US Import Permit. This is available from UC Davis so get in touch with them at the above email contact.

LIST of PUBLICALLY POSTED RESULTS: (and where found for confirmation)

20 March 2008 by szedlisa (Breeder) SZED Spanish Arabians
SZED Hermosa - 87cm (*SZED Payaso x *SZED Halme by Mizar) N/CA, CARRIER
*SZED Halime -79cm (Mizar x Hagia by Zancudo/Urga) CA AFFECTED
SZED Mariposa - 90cm (*Machote x *Merbat by Pachaka) N/CA, CARRIER
MIZAR - 69bs (Saludo x Bizancio II) sire of affected mare. CARRIER
HAGIA - 66cm (Zancudo x Urga) dam of affected mare. CARRIER
*MACHOTE - 79gg (Guadalcacin x Malenca) sire of affected foal. CARRIER
*USIA - 82gm (Latino x Querella) dam of affected foal CARRIER

3 Dec 2008 by szedlisa on ABN-CA thread
MARAJJ - (Marwan Al Shaqab x RGA Khouress) N/CA, CARRIER
RGA KOURESS - (Kouvay Bey x Angophora) N/CA, CARRIER
MARWAN AL SHAQAB - (Gazal Al Shaqab x Little Liza Fame) N/N, normal (clear)

18 Dec 2008 by Silver Shdow ( a repeat but needs to be added here)on ABN-CA thread
MAF SILVER FIRE(CBA60): N/N - Normal: horse does not possess markers associated with CA
ZAPATERO'S MYSTERIOUS GEM(CBA61): N/N - Normal: horse does not possess markers associated with CA
SILVERS LEGACY(CBA62): N/N - Normal: horse does not possess markers associated with CA

23 Dec 2008 by Crimson Farms on ABN-CA thread
Stallions
Desert Heat VF+/ - Clear
Allusion AOF+ (Allionce x Flaring Fire) - Clear
EA Errogonce (Allionce x Twilite) - Clear
WH York (Marwan Al Shaqab x WH Moneca Ren) - Clear
GR Marvel (Marwan Al Shaqab x LC Ferrarit) - Clear
Vertigo CF (Versace x Bint Alianna) - Clear
Miyaz (Gazal Al Shaqab x Kaiynda Special) - Clear
Dana Dulane ( Baywatch V++ x Shannacey D) - Clear

Mares
GH Legend (Legacy Of Fame x Crem Dela Crem) - Clear
GH Falcon Femme (Falcon BHF x La Femme Versace) - Clear
GH Marwana (Marwan Al Shaqab x Verona RA) - Clear

3 Jan 2008 Posted by Crimson Farms on ABN-CA thread
MWF Aleksandria (Negatraz [*Bask x Negotka] x Algadina [Aladdinn x *Algoa]) N/N - Clear
Elia PASB (Eukaliptus [Bandos x Eunice] x Eulalia [Eufrat x Emilia]) N/C- CARRIER
08 Gazal x Elia Colt N/N - Clear

30 Dec 2008 by Hillsbrook Farm on ABN-CA thread
FLORENA PASB (Palas x Flotylla (El Paso)) N/N - Normal
CYMPHONY VF (*Bandos PASB x *Cynadra (Tryptyk)) N/N - Normal
BONNE CHERIE (*Bandos PASB x Bonfieree (*Bask)) N/N - Normal
JAYEL POLYPHONY (*Muscat x Jayel Pollyanna (*Rimmon)) N/CA - CARRIER

31 Dec 2008 by Judy81350 on ABN-CA thread
Addorra is Hope(Sir Topaz(*Muscat) x Faddjurs Angel(Nobilidi):N/N normal, not carrier
Khassandraa(AA Khabor(*Naborr) x Nisans Tiye(Nisans Mohr), N/N normal, not carrier
Magic Spirit(*Nelson(*Mag) x HM Moun Magic(Azor), N/N normal, not carrier

06 Jan 2009 by Moniethorse on sE-CA thread
KM BUGATTI - 05gs (Versace x Sanegors Lady D ) - N/N, Clear

06 Jan 2009 by Carol Cooper-Hall on sE-CA thread
RA Nadirah (Al Adeed Al Shaqab** x Alada Remembrance) - N/N, Clear; also scid clear.

06 Jan 2009 by Allison of Talaria (Talaria Farms) on sE-CA thread
Following stallions are CA and scid Clear:
BOTSWANA - 98bs (Thee Desparado x The Minuet)
S KHONCHERTO - 96bs (JK Amadeus x DW Khemette)
TF AFRIKHAN SHAH (standing in Belgium) - 03bs (BOTSWANA x ROHARA SHAHBLEE)
MADHIN NILE MOON - 05gs (FARID NILE MOON x IMPERIAL MAHREENA)
TF ROYAL SHAHBAZ - 06gs (Falcon BHF x TH Maya Naufali )
TF AFRIKAN ALKHEMI - 03bs (BOTSWANA x RAMSES NOVAGLORI)

14 Jan 2009 by Canadian Kristine,Rennex Arabians, on sE-CA thread
ES California Dreamin (Gazal Al Shaqab X AB Farenheit): N/N, Clear , also scid clear.

14 Jan 2009 by Tchaata, on sE-CA thread
MF ARYAN EL THESSA ( JD Chalice X Thessalya el Jamaal / Ali Jamaal ) : N/N, Clear

14 Jan 2009 by IDL Arabians on ABN-CA thread
ZENZATIONAL V (DESPERADO V x ZAHR ANN) - N/N - Normal
SW KHAMEO (SW KHLINT+ x WCA SATINEE) - N/N - Normal
RNX TRULY A DREAM ( GF FOREVER MAGIC+ x CHELSEA DREAM) - N/N - Normal
WWA CEARA GAZAL ( GAZAL AL SHAQAB x CEARA PJ) - N/N - Normal
Additions on 07 Feb 2009:
IDL Kayden 2008 colt (GF Forever Magic+ x WWA Ceara Gazal) Clear Parents
IDL Khryztal 2006 filly (Zenzational V x SW Khameo) Clear Parents

15 Jan 2009 by "cookie" / J.E. Holloway (UK) on AL-CA thread
Panndora (Vodofon Kossack (Balaton/Verba) x HS Pelagrina (Pilot/Pilarka)- N/N , Clear. Also SCID Clear.

17 Jan 2009 by NadiaKA, Kakaji Arabians ( originally posted 7 Jan 2009) on ABN-CA thread.
*Nefison (Mag x Nefisa by Salon): N/N - Normal
DYN Amber Myst (*Muscat x Modnitsa by Nabeg): N/N - Normal
Karenina kgi (Kilogramm SPA x SH MSana by Mpulse): N/N - Normal
Magadan kgi (*Nefison x DYN Amber Myst) N/N, Clear as parents are clear.
Nastasia kgi (*Nefison x Karenina kgi) N/N, Clear as parents are clear.

ADDITIONS TO KAKAJI ARABIANS AS OF 29 Jan 2009:
SF Nova (*Abdullahhh x Kirova by Namet): N/N - Normal
Tamerlynn (*Tamerlan x Trishia by *Procent): N/N - Normal
NM Rostalgia (RV Rostov x Namusca by *Nariadni): N/N - Normal

And therefore their offspring by *Nefison (already tested clear) are also clear:
Tatariya kgi (*Nefison x Tamerlynn)
Temujin kgi (*Nefison x Tamerlynn)
Riurik kgi (*Nefison x NM Rostalgia)
Prelusion kgi (*Nefison x NM Rostalgia)
Kievan kgi (*Nefison x SF Nova)
Kapteyn kgi (*Nefison x SF Nova)

17 Jan 2009 by Allanglos on ABN-CA thread
FC Casino Royale-99cs (Roll Of The Dice x PKH Shalane) - N/N = Normal

18 Jan 2009 by jcjia on ABH-CA thread
Marcelina BA (Marwan Al Shaqab x R Imagination) - CA - N/N, Clear, also SCID clear

19 Jan 2009 by Burgundy Oaks on ABN-CA thread
Mariankaa (*Muscat x Pattrianka by Marbask) Mariankaa's Pedigree. N/N - Normal:
Pirouett (Pending)(*Piaff x Mariankaa by *Muscat) Pirouett's Pedigree : N/N - Normal

23 Jan 2009 by Irene ( Flying A Ranch) on ABN Hot Topics
NV Beau Bey (Bey Shah+ x Bint Miss Fire) - CA - N/N, Clear
Black (NV Beau Bey x Black Silk) - CA - N/N, Clear
Borsalino Bey (*Borsalino K x Beau's Dancer by NV Beau Bey) - CA - N/N , Clear
Mystic Jamaal (*Soho Carol by Ali Jamaal x Alieka BR by Ali Jamaal)- N/N, Clear

26 Jan 2009 by DarkhHorseFarms (Lisa) on ABN Hot Topics
LL DARKH IMAGE (BC Classic Image x Velvet Darkness) - CA - N/N, Clear

26 Jan 2009 by Joy20 (Gretchen) on ABH Hot Topics
KOUVAY BAY 91bs (Bey Shah+ x BA Preciousmemory) - CA - N/N, Clear
[This is the sire of RGA KOURESS - N/CA, CARRIER]

29 Jan 2009 by darapark ( Maria D) on Global
Kublai Khan - CA - N/N, Clear, also SCID Clear
Om El Akid (imp USA) - CA - N/N, Clear; also SCID Clear.

2 Feb 2009 by Trina Gifford, GS Arrow Ranches, WA ( with permission)
PS Final Edition (Ptersk Shamin x SWL Mishkin) N/CA, CARRIER
SPA MZ Katrina (Poppov x SPA Bint Bonnie) N/CA, CARRIER
GS Yesha Miskin (PS Final Edition X SPA MZ Katrina) N/CA, CARRIER
GS Zaphina Aesha (PS Final Edition x SPA MZ Katrina) CA/CA, AFFECTED

4 Feb 2009 by Helga Madson ( Denmark) on sE.com
Ali Shah, stallion (Al Adeed Al Shaqab x Saida Bint Shahlia by Classic Shadwan / Ansata Shahlia). N/N, Clear

4 Feb 2009 by Kealia on ABN
*Celna - 91gm (Alegro x Cedula by Bandos) N/N, Clear

4 Feb 2009 by Fadtastic ( Kris in Tucson) on ABN
SH-Chelseas Gal - 90gm (SHA-Shaman+/ x Fiestas Samira by *GG Samir) N/CA, CARRIER ( deceased)

6 Feb 2009 by Tous Crins on sE.com
AL GHAZAL - 2002cs (The Renegade x Kirbys Shadow by Sahar El Pharoh) N/N, Clear
WWA ASIL BAHAR - 96gm (Century Shah x Dafina El Masr by Bo-Mars Legend) N/N, Clear

6 Feb 2009 by cate on sE.com:
AHANU - (Emiratus B x Jiwan) N/N, Clear, also scid clear by Dr Van Haeringen Laboratorium b.v. (date: 27/05/08 )

6 Feb 2009 by Kristine on ABN
GF Forever Magic+ (Magic Dream CAHR X GF Providence+) N/N, Clear

7 Feb 2009 by szedlisa with Permission by Linda McCabe on Global
ANGOPHORA - 81cm(*Eukaliptus x Belbowrie Baskana by *Bask) N/CA, CARRIER

14 Feb 2009 by ShannonC ( Sakinah Arabians) on Global & ABN
AMIR AMANTE(CBA243): N/N - Normal
ORIONS DEBUT(CBA248): N/N - Normal

14 Feb 2009 by Aurorawind (Joanne Ogdan) on ABN:
AABSOLUT (PRINCIP X AMARILLA PR BY MARYK), CA Clear, N/N; and scid clear.

14 Feb 2009 by Jen on ABN:
ML EXXODUS(CBA245): CA Clear, N/N; also scid clear.

16 Feb 2009 by Dahabi Arabians on ABN
AMIR SHAKLAN (CBA247) - 2005 grey Arabian stallion (Om El Shahmaan x Asdiqa Badeia) CA Clear N/N; scid clear

15 Feb 2009- Pam Thonsgard:Rice Creek Farm:
LA JARANA(CBA238): 1994 gm (AERIK x *SZ PARILLA By PEPETE): N/N -Clear
RV GLORIAADIOS(CBA239): 1995 cm (*KAR PEPET x SZED HERMOSA By *SZED PAYASO): N/N - Clear (Dam is a tested N/CA - Carrier)
MI ANGELITA ESPECIAL(CBA240):2005 cm (TOBASCCO x LA JARANA By AERIK): N/CA - CARRIER
Results 23 Feb 2009 -
VIVA ELEGANTE(CBA237):1991 gs (*LA SAGURO x *SZ PARILLA By PEPETE): INCONCLUSIVE
RIO BLANCO(CBA236): 1998 gs (VIVA ELEGANTE x TAFALITA By *GG SAMIR)INCONCLUSIVE
Inconclusives to be retested at a later date.

25 Feb 2009 by Emma Maxwell on ArabianLines
PREMIER - 1994cs(Monogramm - Premiera): N/N, Clear also scid cler
ADAWY - 2000 gs (Borneo - Ashiqa): N/N, Clear, also scid clear


28 Feb 2009 by HARAS DEL MAR, Spain on Haras Del Mar WEBSITE:
Marbella HDM - 08bm (Marajj X WDF Sienna by OSA Star Maker) N/N, CA clear
*Miss Yahsminah Elamal - bm (Antar Elamal WN X Andira by Hiro) N/N, CA clear
*Maharaja HDM - bs (Marajj X Miss Yahsminah Elamal by Antar Elamal WN) N/N,CA clear
*Sabrina VII - gm (Crusader X LM Sadunga by El Perfecto) N/N Negative.Non carrier
*Jaria - N/N, Negative.Non carrier
*Gatifa - 98gm ( Pegaz(PL) x Galia by Gil) N/N, Negative.Non carrier

9 March 2009 by Topi at sE.com:
SC Dacaro (Davidoff x Verbala) - N/N - Clear.

For updated information and Publically Disclosed Results on this Status List go to the CA website at http://cerebellarabiotrophy.web.com

Spanish Arabians Photos
http://www.flickr.com/photos/szedlisa/collections/72157600851198212/
Cerebellar Abiotrophy (CA) Info:
http://www.cerebellar-abiotrophy.org/

Edited by - szedlisa on 29 Dec 2009 04:18:50 AM
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vanbro
Bronze Member


United Kingdom
93 Posts

Posted - 21 Mar 2009 :  1:02:46 PM  Show Profile  Send vanbro an AOL message Bookmark this reply Add vanbro to your friends list Send vanbro a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Is there a common thread running thro' the pedigrees/ origins of the affected horses???
That is important information that we all need to know....

VANBRO -
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gsarrow
New Member


11 Posts

Posted - 22 Mar 2009 :  4:13:04 PM  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add gsarrow to your friends list Send gsarrow a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Check out this site - http://cerebellarabiotrophy.web.com all CA info in one spot..
please pass it on.
it has a link to a pedigree site also.

Help prevent CA Affected foals Test before you breed. Visit the CA Web site for Info
http://www.cerebellar-abiotrophy.org/

Edited by - gsarrow on 15 Apr 2009 02:57:20 AM
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szedlisa
Bronze Member


Spain
124 Posts

Posted - 14 Apr 2009 :  5:10:58 PM  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add szedlisa to your friends list Send szedlisa a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Testing for the CA Markers is now available in Europe in the Netherlands:

Contact Dr. Van Haeringen Laboratorium b.v.
Visitor address:
Agro Business Park 100 Telephone +31 (317) 416 402
6708 PW Wageningen Fax +31 (317) 426 117
The Netherlands

Mailing address:
P.O. Box 408 E-mail info@vhlgenetics.com
6700 AK Wageningen Internet http://www.vhlgenetics.com
The Netherlands

To order Tests:
http://www.vhlgenetics.com/vhl/webtable.php?dsrt=paard

The price of a CA test is 57,50 Euro (excl. 19% VAT).
The invoice with bankdetails, will be sent together with the result.

The test can be done on hairroots. Please send in the hairroots and a sample submissionform, which you can print out from our website. ("Genetic properties')
If you cannot print them please let us know and we will send some sample submissionforms by post.

We do not need an import permit.

Please let us know, if you have any question left.

Best regards,
Maria Heida
administration
Dr. Van Haeringen Laboratorium BV
P.O. Box 408
6700 AK Wageningen
Tel +31 317 416 402
Fax +31 317 426 117
www.vhlgenetics.com


Spanish Arabians Photos
http://www.flickr.com/photos/szedlisa/collections/72157600851198212/
Cerebellar Abiotrophy (CA) Info:
http://www.cerebellar-abiotrophy.org/
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szedlisa
Bronze Member


Spain
124 Posts

Posted - 17 Jun 2009 :  2:03:03 PM  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add szedlisa to your friends list Send szedlisa a Private Message  Reply with Quote
AHA Task Force on Genetic Diseases Wants Your Input - Please Take Survey

It is not necessary to be a member of AHA to fill in this survey. Only by working together as an arabian community will we be able to moderate the growth and spread of genetic disorders within our arabian breed. Sp Please take a few minutes to complete this questionaire. Your opinions are valued!

Lisa (the following has just been announced by the AHA Task Force)


The following survey has been set up to help get feedback from the Arabian horse community on some of the key issues the task force is discussing. Although some of the questions are for demographic purposes, please answer all of the questions to the best of your ability and also use the comment boxes as needed. I suspect that after the results from this survey are analyzed, we will be following up with an additional survey, to dig deeper into some of the subjects.

[URL=http://www.surveymonkey.com/s.aspx?sm=wPuB...MwhupNSGQ_3d_3d]http://www.surveymonkey.com/s.aspx?sm=wPuB...MwhupNSGQ_3d_3d[/URL]

Thanks -

Beth Minnich
Chair, AHA Task Force on Genetic Diseases


Spanish Arabians Photos
http://www.flickr.com/photos/szedlisa/collections/72157600851198212/
Cerebellar Abiotrophy (CA) Info:
http://www.cerebellar-abiotrophy.org/
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szedlisa
Bronze Member


Spain
124 Posts

Posted - 17 Jun 2009 :  6:15:08 PM  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add szedlisa to your friends list Send szedlisa a Private Message  Reply with Quote
http://www.surveymonkey.com/s.aspx?sm=wPuBvXmtE_2bHKaMwhupNSGQ_3d_3d

Spanish Arabians Photos
http://www.flickr.com/photos/szedlisa/collections/72157600851198212/
Cerebellar Abiotrophy (CA) Info:
http://www.cerebellar-abiotrophy.org/
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Arabian-Stud-Europe
Bronze Member

Netherlands
173 Posts

Posted - 02 Sep 2009 :  07:37:17 AM  Show Profile  Visit Arabian-Stud-Europe's Homepage  Click to see Arabian-Stud-Europe's MSN Messenger address Bookmark this reply Add Arabian-Stud-Europe to your friends list Send Arabian-Stud-Europe a Private Message  Reply with Quote
ASE Marajů (Marajj x Manilah by Radamess II) is tested N/N (Clear)

Arabian Stud Europe
The Netherlands
http://www.arabianstudeurope.com
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Arabian-Stud-Europe
Bronze Member

Netherlands
173 Posts

Posted - 19 Sep 2009 :  6:27:11 PM  Show Profile  Visit Arabian-Stud-Europe's Homepage  Click to see Arabian-Stud-Europe's MSN Messenger address Bookmark this reply Add Arabian-Stud-Europe to your friends list Send Arabian-Stud-Europe a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Don't know if you guys heard it yet, but WH Justice is tested CA Carrier

Arabian Stud Europe
The Netherlands
http://www.arabianstudeurope.com
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Arabian-Stud-Europe
Bronze Member

Netherlands
173 Posts

Posted - 22 Sep 2009 :  08:29:38 AM  Show Profile  Visit Arabian-Stud-Europe's Homepage  Click to see Arabian-Stud-Europe's MSN Messenger address Bookmark this reply Add Arabian-Stud-Europe to your friends list Send Arabian-Stud-Europe a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Marhaabah (Marwan al Shaqab x Shalina el Jamaal) is tested SCID Clear & CA Clear!!

Arabian Stud Europe
The Netherlands
http://www.arabianstudeurope.com
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littlearabians
Gold Member

1323 Posts

Posted - 09 Oct 2009 :  08:42:17 AM  Show Profile  Visit littlearabians's Homepage Bookmark this reply Add littlearabians to your friends list Send littlearabians a Private Message  Reply with Quote
TU Champion is tested and found CA and SCID clear

www.littlearabians.com
Classic Polish Arabians


Worcester based

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Scarlet Arabian
Silver Member


England
339 Posts

Posted - 12 Oct 2009 :  4:19:23 PM  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add Scarlet Arabian to your friends list Send Scarlet Arabian a Private Message  Reply with Quote
has CA been found in any partbreds?

would it be possible for high percentage arabians to pass on CA?


Abby





stacatto wind...... kharibe........salana A/A........julien p/b........scarlet...

whitsbury/new forest
www.scarletarabianbridles.co.uk
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SueB
Platinum Member


United Kingdom
3218 Posts

Posted - 13 Oct 2009 :  11:09:15 AM  Show Profile  Send SueB an AOL message Bookmark this reply Add SueB to your friends list Send SueB a Private Message  Reply with Quote

Result test came today.


We are really pleased to announce that our stallion, AV Montoya (WH Justice x Metelica 8) is CA Clear.

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gu-ku-vi
Gold Member

Denmark
744 Posts

Posted - 23 Oct 2009 :  2:42:03 PM  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add gu-ku-vi to your friends list Send gu-ku-vi a Private Message  Reply with Quote
From Stald GKV Denmark

Marbon Martini(El Sharluke x Narrifet) N/N clear

Silver Zara Saint(Shaded Silver x Zafika) N/N clear

GKV Sami(Moulton Millennium x Silver Zara Saint) N/N clear

KR Gunni.

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Sirius
Bronze Member

England
102 Posts

Posted - 10 Nov 2009 :  10:27:06 PM  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add Sirius to your friends list Send Sirius a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Hey, hang on a minute! What does this direct copy and paste quote from the Van Haerigen website description of the test I was about to pay for and label my horses actually mean??

"The genetic test for CA is not completely finished, as the specific mutation that causes the disease has not been found yet. However, a group of genetic DNA-markers next to the disease gene can be used as an indirect test. The CA test is based on a specific set of DNA-variation which is co-inherited with the disease. As a result, the indirect test predicts the status of the actual mutation.

"Because the genetic test for CA is not completely finished yet, additional pedigree information or samples from a parent may be required to complete a test."


I will go with proven science, but this hasn't been presented in a way that I can believe in.

Dom
Physicist.

Edited by - Sirius on 10 Nov 2009 11:11:30 PM
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gu-ku-vi
Gold Member

Denmark
744 Posts

Posted - 13 Nov 2009 :  11:10:10 AM  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add gu-ku-vi to your friends list Send gu-ku-vi a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Stald GKV Denmark:

GKV Meadley (Moulton Millennium x Marbon Mead) N/N = CA clear.

Gunni.
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linda
Platinum Member

United Kingdom
1772 Posts

Posted - 19 Nov 2009 :  11:12:31 PM  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add linda to your friends list Send linda a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Spring Kantata (Normativ x Sunlea Kaprina) is CA Clear
Nadynaa (Nabucco x Spring Kantata) is CA Clear
Antigua El jamaal (Al Kidir x Athenias El Jamaal) is CA Clear


L. Lyall
Affinity Arabians UK

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winddy
New Member

2 Posts

Posted - 29 Nov 2009 :  9:56:52 PM  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add winddy to your friends list Send winddy a Private Message  Reply with Quote
I would like some more information concerning the CA -

I am considering purchasing an Arabian / Hackney mix, but I recently discovered this very sad disease.

the dam of the horse that I am looking
at is Cymphony..


being that this Arab that I am looking at is 1/2 Arab is this CA still a concern, and should the mare
(6 years old) be tested???...

any new information concerning CA will also be appreciated, I have been reading the forums as best as possible, and trying to get more information concerning it.


I had a Quarter Horse that was tested for HYPP back in 1992. The test came up negative but thru the years he had all the symptoms and so we retired him early. I think it would be very very hard on me if I were to purchase a horse that might possibly end up having some similiar (or worse) problems.


is this a possibility like HYPP?
in other words.. could a horse that tests negative start displaying symptoms anyway??

Thru time, I eventually joined forums for those of us with HYPP negative horses but the horses showed the symptoms.. many of them passed on and it was just heartbreaking. Our gelding is now 20, and retired on a 40 acre farm the past 7 years. I believe doing so has saved his life as I could not see him surviving here in the Chicago area, stuck in a stall most of the day. 100% freedom has given him strength...


sorry to ramble, I am so nervous about this and my
heart breaks for any of you and your horses that have sufferered from this sad and horrible disease...
(CA)

Bonny
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szedlisa
Bronze Member


Spain
124 Posts

Posted - 08 Dec 2009 :  2:41:15 PM  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add szedlisa to your friends list Send szedlisa a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Bonny (aka windy),

For a fully informative read on CA, go to the Cerebellar Abiotropy website posted below and do view the video-clips which show the clinical signs of affected CA foals/fillies:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ipnpQonib94

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sj5RL3CmS34 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sj5RL3CmS34

Be sure to keep well posted with the latest updates on publically disclosed status at the Cerebellar abiotrophy website:
http://cerebellarabiotrophy.webs.com/http://cerebellarabiotrophy.webs.com/

A purebred arabian CA Carrier can pass forward the defecive mutated allele when bred to another breed of horse. So for your own peace ofmind, I suggest that you go ahead and test. I have found a part arabian by the name of Cymphony , 1999 bay mare (Europejczyk x Color Me Monogram) and a 1985 bay mare , purebred of the same name (KK Bravura x Cymbel). The first carries known ca carrier lines close up and the second has known carrier lines after the 4th and 5th generation. CA is an autosomal recessive and needs both parents to be carriers in order to produce an affected foal.

And just to point out the unexpected: What with ESTOPASAN, ECAHO, WH JUSTICE, MAGNUM PSYCHE, and now an affected foal by ML MOSTLY PADRON out of a GG SAMIR daughter, some very well known and popular breeding stock are being designated as CA Carriers.

Best to keep updated and test your own stock before breeding.

Lisa

Spanish Arabians Photos
http://www.flickr.com/photos/szedlisa/collections/72157600851198212/
Cerebellar Abiotrophy (CA) Info:
http://www.cerebellar-abiotrophy.org/

Edited by - szedlisa on 08 Dec 2009 2:43:15 PM
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szedlisa
Bronze Member


Spain
124 Posts

Posted - 08 Dec 2009 :  3:00:47 PM  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add szedlisa to your friends list Send szedlisa a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Dom,

I certainly appreciate your viewoint and you are not alone in quering the validity of the Marker Scanning Test aka a pre-DNA genetic based test for CA.

What you are getting with the results of this test is the sound knowledge that the marker clusters which accompany the defective mutated CA allele are either in existance or not in existance. If they are expressed then the horse is a CA Carrier. If they are not expressed then the horse is clear and does not carry the defective mutated allele for CA. These marker clusters have accompanied the defective allele 100% to date. UC Davis calls the test "robust" and "sound". The samples sent to Holland to the Van Haeringen Lab in Holland are being sent on to UC Davis for verification.

Lisa



Originally posted by Sirius

Hey, hang on a minute! What does this direct copy and paste quote from the Van Haerigen website description of the test I was about to pay for and label my horses actually mean??

"The genetic test for CA is not completely finished, as the specific mutation that causes the disease has not been found yet. However, a group of genetic DNA-markers next to the disease gene can be used as an indirect test. The CA test is based on a specific set of DNA-variation which is co-inherited with the disease. As a result, the indirect test predicts the status of the actual mutation.

"Because the genetic test for CA is not completely finished yet, additional pedigree information or samples from a parent may be required to complete a test."


I will go with proven science, but this hasn't been presented in a way that I can believe in.

Dom
Physicist.

Spanish Arabians Photos
http://www.flickr.com/photos/szedlisa/collections/72157600851198212/
Cerebellar Abiotrophy (CA) Info:
http://www.cerebellar-abiotrophy.org/

Edited by - szedlisa on 08 Dec 2009 3:05:26 PM
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winddy
New Member

2 Posts

Posted - 08 Dec 2009 :  8:59:21 PM  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add winddy to your friends list Send winddy a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Yes - my name is Bonny.. ;-)
thanks for your reply!!

I do have the mare here -

and the vet will be coming out on friday
for the "exam"..

the farrier gives her a thumbs up and says go for it..
He thinks that she is a very nice horse.

She had some shoeing/trimming troubles, but he believes with corrective trimming she will be just fine.

She is a little off at the canter, but he believes that is because of the way the feet were trimmed..

pictures coming soon,
and thank you everyone for your help!!
She is a very sweet little horse, and besides the usual gangliness/awkwardness
of a young horse, she seems just fine..


FYI - I have absolutely no intentions of breedering her..


Bonny

Originally posted by szedlisa

Bonny (aka windy),

For a fully informative read on CA, go to the Cerebellar Abiotropy website posted below and do view the video-clips which show the clinical signs of affected CA foals/fillies:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ipnpQonib94

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sj5RL3CmS34 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sj5RL3CmS34

Be sure to keep well posted with the latest updates on publically disclosed status at the Cerebellar abiotrophy website:
http://cerebellarabiotrophy.webs.com/http://cerebellarabiotrophy.webs.com/

A purebred arabian CA Carrier can pass forward the defecive mutated allele when bred to another breed of horse. So for your own peace ofmind, I suggest that you go ahead and test. I have found a part arabian by the name of Cymphony , 1999 bay mare (Europejczyk x Color Me Monogram) and a 1985 bay mare , purebred of the same name (KK Bravura x Cymbel). The first carries known ca carrier lines close up and the second has known carrier lines after the 4th and 5th generation. CA is an autosomal recessive and needs both parents to be carriers in order to produce an affected foal.

And just to point out the unexpected: What with ESTOPASAN, ECAHO, WH JUSTICE, MAGNUM PSYCHE, and now an affected foal by ML MOSTLY PADRON out of a GG SAMIR daughter, some very well known and popular breeding stock are being designated as CA Carriers.

Best to keep updated and test your own stock before breeding.

Lisa

Bonny
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Sirius
Bronze Member

England
102 Posts

Posted - 22 Dec 2009 :  11:05:25 AM  Show Profile Bookmark this reply Add Sirius to your friends list Send Sirius a Private Message  Reply with Quote
[right]Originally posted by szedlisa

Dom,

I certainly appreciate your viewoint and you are not alone in quering the validity of the Marker Scanning Test aka a pre-DNA genetic based test for CA.

What you are getting with the results of this test is the sound knowledge that the marker clusters which accompany the defective mutated CA allele are either in existance or not in existance. If they are expressed then the horse is a CA Carrier. If they are not expressed then the horse is clear and does not carry the defective mutated allele for CA. These marker clusters have accompanied the defective allele 100% to date. UC Davis calls the test "robust" and "sound". The samples sent to Holland to the Van Haeringen Lab in Holland are being sent on to UC Davis for verification.

Lisa

Thanks for your reply, but I'm still not happy. I think that testing now could actually lead to a worsening of the situation if people are overconfident about their results.

My problem is in your assertion that the markers accompany 100% of defective alleles. I would suggest that this is over confident. I am sure that it is a confident statement in that 100% of unambiguously diagnosed affected CA/CA so far tested have been reported to have the markers. I presume that UC Davis have been breeding and testing a herd of N/CA and CA/CA in-house rather than just testing samples from the national herd. However, it is vital to identify all of the carriers and only the carriers in this, and my worry is that those who test now will believe the results are definitive.

I am quite concerned that we now have people posting "clear" results with the implied confidence that the horses are N/N. Undoubtedly they have tested for all of the right reasons, and have done absolutely everything available to avoid breeding CA/CA foals, but there are three big questions for me:

1/ With rare bloodlines said to be carrying the CA allele, will owners of quality horses that have CA/N indications now terminate those lines? A great shame if so, as our experience of SCID, and of PRA, CNM, EIC and narcolepsy in labradors, shows that they can be completely eradicated in two generations at the worst;

2/ Will those people retest their horses if/when the allele is identified and a direct test becomes available? This is my main concern, as I was about to spend around £1000 which I cannot afford to do and then redo.

3/ Have any clears thrown positive results for the markers, or is this possible? Indeed, is there a way of knowing the answer to this, as carriers are asymptomatic? If the test mislabels a rare-lined clear as a carrier, that could terminate what we are all trying to preserve. Only a very large test herd can answer this question, and then over several generations.

If the current test eventually proves not to be 99.99% reliable in picking up the defective allele in the wider international herd, the premature publication of "clear" results could actually have an enormously damaging Affect(sic). If our stallions test N/N, then with our plans they will be breeding prolifically, and the publication of their results will probably increase the number of mares visiting them, helping to recoup the testing cost.

There are a number of cases of carrier labrador retrievers of magnificent working achievement who have had truely monsterous numbers of puppies, e.g. XXX who sired over 8000 and was certainly a carrier. Their owners all used the best knowledge available at the time to produce the best quality sire dogs, and the parallel is chilling.


Let me add that I am a huge believer in testing. All of our herd are SCID tested, and the results are publicly available on our website especially the late Hanson's SCID carrier status. We have been successfully breeding out the large number of genetic diseases that afflict working labradors, and have the most tested (and most multiply completely N/N clear) working breeding pack in the UK. I went onto the Van Haeringen website specifically to find the test order form for CA, which is where I found the info I originally quoted.


We will test, publish, and publicise as soon as we are confident that the test available is definitive. In the meanime, we are certainly more aware of the possibility of CA and will be vigilant.

Dom
Seren Arabians

p.s. I want to be wrong on this one!

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SueB
Platinum Member


United Kingdom
3218 Posts

Posted - 26 Dec 2009 :  11:24:39 AM  Show Profile  Send SueB an AOL message Bookmark this reply Add SueB to your friends list Send SueB a Private Message  Reply with Quote
I have looked at your web site Dom and realise your concern over CA. Don't be concerned and don't sit there and do nothing. Test your stallions at least, if they are positive or negative, with this present day test you can at least have some legal back up in the case of a foal being born affected from an outside mare.
Any stallion who is positive should not be culled or not, not used for breeding, as you yourself have proved with a Scid carrying stallion, (I know he is gone now) it does not effect their use.
If people want that blood or like that horse they will still use them.
We will all re-test if a new test comes out, but for now we do what we can.

Here is the link to a video of a Justice filly PTS and an article about CA.

http://www.kullatorp.com/eng/ca/ca.htm

Edited by - SueB on 26 Dec 2009 1:54:26 PM
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